Wissota powered skate sharpener review

[tstop4me]

Hallelujah! The math worked! I was over the top with joy! Boy, am I having fun!

...

Good heavens, the prediction was right on!

It's reassuring that geometrical analysis, measurements, and math work.  Sid Broadbent took this approach when he designed the Incredible Edger; he was a former aerospace engineer.  But this approach doesn't get passed on to skate techs who use his machine.  I met one hockey coach who sharpens skates with this approach (with a different machine); turned out he was previously a tech at a steel mill.  I think there would be fewer screwups if all skate techs learned this approach for setup.

[tstop4me]

There is one little thing that I will keep in mind. The wax could be seen melting where the wheel touched the blade. Perhaps it will prevent the steel from losing temper along the edge because the wax melting and evaporating might keep the steel a bit cooler. That would affect edge life, not finish.

I thought the wax was used only for the final pass.  Is that correct?  If so, there would be no wax-assisted cooling for most of the sharpening run, and you would run the highest risk of burning the steel prior to applying the wax.

[Bill_S]

Yes, the wax is used for the final "finishing" pass only. That's how I used it.

In some online videos (yeah, I know) the finishing pass is the one done in the opposite direction than the initial passes, and is done slower.

I don't like the "slower" part because of the possibility of grinding in small irregularities. The regular passes (~1 inch/second) work fine, and I'll experiment with the wax at the regular speeds.

At any rate, I didn't see much improvement so far. Time will tell.

[Bill_S]

Skating on the blades went very well today. The blades felt very fast, probably because 1) fresh sharpenings always feel faster, 2) the blade surface was very smooth, and 3) the hollow is a flatter 7/16" instead of 3/8". I really pushed into the ice today and was rewarded with a lot of speed.

The conclusion is that everything is just fine. I'm up and running with this new sharpener.

[tstop4me]

The conclusion is that everything is just fine. I'm up and running with this new sharpener.

Glad it's all worked out, and in a much shorter time than I had anticipated.  I have a good grasp of the measurement and setup procedures.  What caused me to shy away from buying the Wissota in the past is the manual manipulation of the skate holder during the sharpening process:  pressure of the blade against the wheel, feed rate of the blade, and tracing the contour of the blade are all coupled and done by hand.  I was under the impression that this would take considerable practice to develop the skill, as well as constant use to maintain the skill.  That doesn't appear to be the case with you.  In previous posts, you've indicated that you have two bench grinders plus a Tormek power sharpener.  Do you feel that your past hands-on experience on these units already gave you the right touch with the Wissota?  Or do you feel that this part of the operation is fairly straightforward?

[Bill_S]

It's easier than you expect. Maybe some of my previous experience helps, but as long as you maintain light, even pressure, and don't slow down or speed up halfway through, you'll be fine. That assumes a properly set up skate holder though.

The 100 grit "figure skate" wheel that I'm using is gentle and forgiving. It doesn't hog off material like a standard 80 grit wheel. That makes it more resistant to user bobbles, plus rewards you with a very smooth surface.

I don't think it is as hard as many people make it out to be. You just have to think about what you are doing. Going slow during setup is a virtue.

[Bill_S]

I was handed a set of depleted Gold Seals today to practice with. Gold Seals have side honing, so many skate sharpener holders can't clamp on that blade geometry.

They clamped up just fine in the Wissota Figure Skate holder. It holds the blade by the stanchions, which have not been machined.



I had just sharpened my Ace blades yesterday, and the stanchion thickness of the Gold Seal blades were identical. I made no adjustment and took the blade straight to the sharpener.

Perfect!

There is one wrinkle though. The "reference" piece of the Wissota Elite even edge checker kit won't work with blades lacking flat sides. The side honing of the Gold Seal prevents the usage of it. My Eclipse Dance blades, being ground to a "thin line" edge for 1/4", can't use both edge checker parts either.

You can still sight against the skate holder itself using the edge checker piece that lies across the edges. You get close, but not as accurately as you can with a flat-sided blade using both parts.



The Wissota Elite Edge Checker essentially becomes their $40 Basic Edge Checker with these blades. I suspect that it's still just fine.

[tstop4me]

There is one wrinkle though. Half of the Wissota Elite even edge checker won't work with a non-flat blade sides. The side honing of the Gold Seal prevents the usage of it. My Eclipse Dance blades, being ground to a "thin line" edge for 1/4", can't use both edge checker parts either.

You can still sight against the skate holder itself using the edge checker part that lies across the edges and get very close, but not as accurately as you can with a flat side blade using both parts.

Paramount produces three configurations of edge checkers to accommodate the various blades on the market.  They are all two-piece units (measurement bar and reference horizon bar), like the Wissota unit.  The measurement bar is the same for all, and is attached to the edges via a magnet, just as in the Wissota unit.  The design of the reference horizon bar varies, to accommodate different types of blades.  See https://www.paramountskates.com/videos (Sharpening & Leveling at 3:15 on).  For blades that do not have parallel, planar sides, the reference horizon bar clamps onto the stanchions.  The main deficiency of the Paramount units is that the reference horizon bar does not have graduation marks to give you an estimate of how off-level you are.

People who design blades should give more consideration to how blades are sharpened and checked.

[Bill_S]

That's a nice set of measurement tools. I see that the Paramount skates use a standard hockey-style skate holder to grip the runner.

They appear to be in control of their manufacturing tolerances when it comes to rockers and blade thickness.

[tstop4me]

That's a nice set of measurement tools. I see that the Paramount skates use a standard hockey-style skate holder to grip the runner.

They appear to be in control of their manufacturing tolerances when it comes to rockers and blade thickness.

Most Paramount blades can't use standard hockey-style holders:  the runners aren't wide enough.  They need to be held by the stanchions.  There is a YouTube video showing that the Wissota figure-skate holder that you have does work (the aluminum-alloy stanchions are a lot thicker than normal steel stanchions, and some figure-skate holder jaws don't open wide enough).  There is another video showing Paramount blades mounted on Sid Broadbent's Incredible Edger. 

Paramount was also guilty in their initial designs of not taking into account how a typical skate tech would sharpen and check the edges.  Paramount had to develop their own custom edge checker.  Within this past year, Paramount has introduced two intermediate-grade blades that can be sharpened with standard hockey-style holders:  the runners are wider.  Unfortunately they are available in 420 stainless steel only, not the better grade 440C.  I think Paramount would have wider acceptance if they were easier to sharpen.  Not sure whether they will redesign their advance patterns:  the wider runners will add some extra weight, and Paramount keeps pushing light weight as one of their biggest selling points.

It would be great if someone at your rink has a worn-out Paramount for you to play with.  Wissota does not recommend the 100 grit wheel for stainless steel blades.  I wonder what the finish is like with the 80 grit wheel; and whether you have as easy a control.  I suppose you could use the 100 grit wheel for a final pass if needed for a better finish, but you would have to swap wheels (that's why I previously asked how easy it is to swap wheels).  I don't think most pro skate techs would do that; but for personal use, certainly viable.

[Bill_S]

Within this past year, Paramount has introduced two intermediate-grade blades that can be sharpened with standard hockey-style holders

That must be what I saw when I glanced through the Paramount offerings.

Just FYI, it looks like the clamp itself can clamp up to ~1/2" thick stanchions. There's sufficient thread for that. The photo below shows the threads and finger nut, but the top part of the clamp is lying in the background. I measured the 1/2" with the top clamp in position and the finger nut loosened to about 5 or 6 threads left.



If you need more than 1/2", the threaded studs look to be standard 1/4-20 bolts inserted from the underside. Just find longer bolts to handle extra thick stanchions.

You'd have to adjust the skate holder downward by half the stanchion thickness. I took a rough look at how much down travel is left, and it looks to be roughly 1/2". The plate can move only as far as the locking nut nestled inside the springs, not the whole 0.7" showing on the ruler. That should be more than enough for fairly thick Paramount stanchions.



So what is the thickness of a Paramount aluminum stanchion?

[Bill_S]

When I purchased the sharpener, I purchased additional accessories like the Elite Edge Checker, sharpening wax, the 100-grit wheel for figure skates, plus a toe pick protector.

The toe pick protector looked familiar, but couldn't place it right off the top of my head.



It fastens to the blade to protect the toe pick from being accidentally ground when sharpening. (It's obviously too late for the junk blade in the photo!)



I finally realized where I had seen those before. They are devices to clamp onto a machinist's square to set a fixed measurement. I checked McMaster-Carr and found them listed for under $5 per pair. https://www.mcmaster.com/square-holding-clamps

I paid $14.99 for one of them from Wissota.

There's a place where you can save a little money.

[Bill_S]

I wanted to quantify the errors indicated by the Wissota Elite Edge Checker when used to check for level edges. Along the way, I discovered this. The wedge of light appearing between the Starrett square body and the edge checker indicates a squareness problem.



This piece of the two-part tool wasn't mounted square to the magnetic attachment. That would indicate level edges when in fact, they are not. I already sharpened my own skates using it this way, so they don't have perfectly level edges. Frankly, I didn't detect it skating yesterday, so I must be able to tolerate slightly uneven edges.

But still, I don't like inaccurate tools. I suspected that the heavy paint application caused this. The paint built up in ridges around its edges, including the mounting holes for the magnet. Two screws took the unit apart for fixing.

I placed sandpaper on a flat surface to smooth the paint on the magnetic block. This surface had irregular ridges of paint around the mating edges, so they were flattened by rubbing it against the sandpaper.



I also took a small file to flatten the paint on the bottom where the magnet mounts. I did squareness checks as I leveled the paint to ensure that I didn't go too far.



The photo above shows obvious paint build-up on edges, and where I removed some of the high spots from around the mounting holes.

I now have this perfectly square piece.



There are a lot of edge checkers out there that work like this. I wonder how many of them need a little TLC for best results?

[tstop4me]

So what is the thickness of a Paramount aluminum stanchion?

Right blade:  mid-stanchion and heel stanchion both .341"

Left blade:  mid-stanchion and heel stanchion both .343"

[Measured with a micrometer with .0001" vernier; rounded to nearest .001".]

What I call the mid-stanchion is the rear stanchion on the toe plate.

This confirms that the Wissota figure skate holder should work with Paramount blades.

[Bill_S]

Yes, agreed that it should work. Easily.

[tstop4me]

There are a lot of edge checkers out there that work like this. I wonder how many of them need a little TLC for best results?

That's disappointing for a $100 tool.  ETA:  At least you were able to readily correct the alignment on the Wissota measurement piece, since the magnet was secured with screws.  I've come across other units in which the magnet was secured with adhesive.

[Bill_S]

Actually, the magnet itself is a little round rare earth magnet potted into a small piece of aluminum. The aluminum block that holds the magnet is drilled and tapped for mounting. Nothing wrong with the basic design, but the implementation of it, with unexpectedly heavy paint in places, caused the issue.



Easy 45-minute fix though.

[tstop4me]

I finally realized where I had seen those before. They are devices to clamp onto a machinist's square to set a fixed measurement. I checked McMaster-Carr and found them listed for under $5 per pair. https://www.mcmaster.com/square-holding-clamps

You mentioned that the toe protector fell off in the course of your first run, and you continued without it.  Was this just a matter of you being over cautious the first time and not tightening it enough, or did you find out the cause?  You've mentioned that the motor runs smooth, so I assume that it didn't come off due to vibration.  Have you successfully used the toe protector in subsequent runs?  Any mods, such as thread lock or thread tape, needed?  [ETA:  When I first saw it, it reminded me of a ground wire connector.]

[Bill_S]

I just didn't tighten it enough. I have used it on subsequent blades. Being soft brass, it shouldn't mark the skate blade even with it being clamped tighter.

One issue is that it tends to stick out pretty far and limit how close to the pick you can grind. It can be positioned differently to help with that, and it's something I will investigate more thoroughly.

I did order the look-alikes from McMaster-Carr yesterday, together with a set of Starrett radius gauges. I should have the items here by later afternoon and I'll post comparison photos.

[Bill_S]

Well, I have my first customer as of this morning. One of the local young adult skaters attends morning freestyle sessions. She started the season in September with some rust on the bottom of her blades, and had the local rink sharpen them. That was before they put up the sign saying they wouldn't sharpen figure skates any more.

After the session ended today, I checked her blades for level edges. This is what she had at the rear of her blades...



Ugh! That has to affect her skating!

Knowing that I have the new sharpener, she asked me if I could sharpen them. I agreed to. I'll do them early next week to suite her skating schedule.

One of the coaches here skates in Paramount blades. I tried out the edge level checker on them, and it worked fine. On Paramounts, the blade's aluminum chassis prevents the checker's side magnet from going all the way down, but there's still enough side engagement on the blade that it works. I was happy to learn that.

She has her skates sharpened in Columbus by an individual, not a rink, and her blades were perfectly even. That fellow knows what he is doing.

[Bill_S]

The alternate toe pick protectors arrived today. They are called "stair guages" and are meant to be attached to squares for repeated marking.



These must be common. There are some slight differences between the "toe pick protector" provided by Wissota and these, but nothing that inhibits their function.

 

The hole in the bottom of the Wissota-provided unit means nothing. It's just a manufacturing choice between two different brands, I suspect.

The new ones work like a charm...



They might even be available in well-stocked hardware stores. They are certainly inexpensive.

[Bill_S]

In the recent order that I just placed for the brass pieces, I included a set of radius gauges to measure the hollow of blades. I also wanted to verify that the diamond dresser markings were accurate on the dresser. The diamond dresser rotates around the edge of the grinding wheel, and rounds it to produce the hollow desired by the skater.



..and a close-up showing the markings on it. The screw head is the indicator for the markings on the diamond dresser.



I used the radius gauges to verify its accuracy. I'm happy to report that this has been set very accurately on the Wissota sharpener.

[tstop4me]

They might even be available in well-stocked hardware stores. They are certainly inexpensive.

Home Depot.

$2.51/pair (Johnson) https://www.homedepot.com/p/Johnson-Brass-Stair-Gauges-2-Pack-405/100353821

$4.97/pair (Empire, with hole)  https://www.homedepot.com/p/Empire-3-4-in-Brass-Stair-Gauges-2-Pack-105/100162901

[Bill_S]

Wow - that IS cheap!

[tstop4me]

..and a close-up showing the markings on it. The screw head is the indicator for the markings on the diamond dresser.

I really have to hand it to Wissota for clever design; particularly use of off-the-shelf components in an unexpected application.