Some really dubious skate sharpeners :)

Query · March 01, 2021, 09:54:10 PM

I looked for skate sharpeners at AliExpress - a company that mostly imports cheap Chinese-made equipment. I was not impressed.

BTW, many Chinese scientists and engineers are extremely competent, and some Chinese-made equipment is of extremely high quality.

Examples:

1. https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4001010516775.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.0.0.7bb447b1K8ArkN&algo_pvid=0dcf8778-460a-439e-b326-06bf72f3043b&algo_expid=0dcf8778-460a-439e-b326-06bf72f3043b-0&btsid=0bb0624516146358629515758e47de&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_,searchweb201603_

Sandstone is not very durable.

QuoteOnly 3-10 seconds needed to restore a damaged skate blade and make it perfect again.

Maybe it mostly just straightens out the edge. Not a bad thing - but it isn't sharpening.

Quotefit most skate blade widths and won't affect blade's hollow or radius.

When you sharpen, you generally want to RESTORE the ROH (radius of hollow), which tends to flatten out when you skate.

QuoteAdjustable design suitable for most ice hockey skate blades, figure skate blades goalie skate blades and dance
Adjustable Slot Width: 3-4mm

About .118 - .157". I've found some sources that say it isn't a large enough range.

QuoteSandstone (LxDia.): Approx. 23x10mm

So ROH =5 mm=.197". Typical U.S. skaters use 3/8"=.375" to 1/2"=.5"

2. https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32977198923.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.0.0.7bb447b1K8ArkN&algo_pvid=0dcf8778-460a-439e-b326-06bf72f3043b&algo_expid=0dcf8778-460a-439e-b326-06bf72f3043b-12&btsid=0bb0624516146358629515758e47de&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_,searchweb201603_

QuoteThe inside material of this sharpener is made of diamond

They mean the grit. At that price? The sharpening stone (cylinder) looks very coarse and crude.

QuoteOne side grinder width is 3 mm, and the other side is 4 mm. Also, it can be adjusted by the screw to reach the appropriate width.

As above.

QuoteDiamond: Approx. 0.9x0.4in/23x10mm (Length and Diameter)

Query · March 01, 2021, 10:01:33 PM

For comparison, other relatively cheap powered sharpening machines, from reputable sources. (not a complete list)

These are more expensive, but they look more adjustable (perhaps except for Sparx), have good reputations, and you can buy replacement parts, and contact the companies.

10. Wissota 911 sharpener: https://wissota.com Starting at $1125 (+shipping?)

The video makes operation pretty clear.

You can adjust the ROH, rather than be stuck with one or two.

They cite $6/sharpening. Sounds high. I get maybe a hundred or more simple sharpenings out of a $100 Pro-Filer. But maybe if you only dress the wheel for one ROH, it is cheaper?

11. Blademaster SPB850

Possibly the biggest sharpening company.

http://blademaster.com/web/usa/en/blademaster/460-spb850.html
Skate Sharpener with holder (bench model) $1095 (+shipping?) (their lowest end model)

Note: "Setup and Training included with all new skate sharpeners.": Doesn't seem possible with their cheapest machines, like this one. I wonder where that training is.

Perhaps they only mean the documents and videos they have online - some of which are hard to find, though there are a lot of videos on Youtube? The catalog says something about "hands on training".

The catalog says this has 1/2 hp motor, 120 V * 7.5 A = 900 watts, which would be 1.21 hp input electric power.

12. Blademaster SPB750

http://blademaster.com/web/usa/en/portable-machines/598-spb750.html
Figure Skate Sharpening Starter Kit (portable) $1291 (+ shipping?)
Same machine, extra equipment.

13. Sparx (automatic, possibly light duty, less adjustable than above machines; I was told the supplies are expensive if you want to make major changes. But we are only talking about a $49 wheel (from discount sellers) for about 40 sharpenings - much less than the $6/sharpening Wisota mentions. I don't know whether you can modify the rocker profile, or re-establish a figure skate sweet spot [rocker radius transition point], etc.) Not many figure skaters go for this brand, though they have a figure skating bundle, and I don't know if picky hockey skaters who want to re-profile their blades go for it either.

https://sparxhockey.com Starting at $700.

14. Others - see http://salemskates.com/skate_sharpeners.html. I don't know anything about the other brands mentioned here.

supersharp · March 02, 2021, 12:28:15 AM

Quote from: Query on March 01, 2021, 09:54:10 PM
I looked for skate sharpeners at AliExpress - a company that mostly imports cheap Chinese-made equipment. I was not impressed.

BTW, many Chinese scientists and engineers are extremely competent, and some Chinese-made equipment is of extremely high quality.

Examples:

1. https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4001010516775.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.0.0.7bb447b1K8ArkN&algo_pvid=0dcf8778-460a-439e-b326-06bf72f3043b&algo_expid=0dcf8778-460a-439e-b326-06bf72f3043b-0&btsid=0bb0624516146358629515758e47de&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_,searchweb201603_

Sandstone is not very durable.

Maybe it mostly just straightens out the edge. Not a bad thing - but it isn't sharpening.

When you sharpen, you generally want to RESTORE the ROH (radius of hollow), which tends to flatten out when you skate.

About .118 - .157". I've found some sources that say it isn't a large enough range.
So ROH =5 mm=.197". Typical U.S. skaters use 3/8"=.375" to 1/2"=.5"

2. https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32977198923.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.0.0.7bb447b1K8ArkN&algo_pvid=0dcf8778-460a-439e-b326-06bf72f3043b&algo_expid=0dcf8778-460a-439e-b326-06bf72f3043b-12&btsid=0bb0624516146358629515758e47de&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_,searchweb201603_
They mean the grit. At that price? The sharpening stone (cylinder) looks very coarse and crude.
As above.Again, an ROH of about .2".
A lot of the sharpeners at Aliexpress have that ROH. Could it be common there?

3. https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4000178138602.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.0.0.7bb447b1K8ArkN&algo_pvid=0dcf8778-460a-439e-b326-06bf72f3043b&algo_expid=0dcf8778-460a-439e-b326-06bf72f3043b-27&btsid=0bb0624516146358629515758e47de&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_,searchweb201603_

Has coarse and fine grit stones, like Profiler. ("80 mesh and 400 mesh". Are those U.S. grit sizes?) Pro-filer's fine stone is not diamond.

But again 3mm-4mm thickness. ROH=.24" - a little better, but at the very sharp range of the spectrum.

4. https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32896801496.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.0.0.7bb447b1K8ArkN&algo_pvid=78744128-a393-4ffa-8d00-97da8deea121&algo_expid=78744128-a393-4ffa-8d00-97da8deea121-18&btsid=0bb0622916146398656028802e1b54&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_,searchweb201603_

I love the shape of the blades in their picture. It is designed to fit an inline skate frame.

5. https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005001935533777.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.0.0.7bb447b1K8ArkN&algo_pvid=78744128-a393-4ffa-8d00-97da8deea121&algo_expid=78744128-a393-4ffa-8d00-97da8deea121-31&btsid=0bb0622916146398656028802e1b54&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_,searchweb201603_

ROH=.295". Still pretty small.

6. https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4000293271460.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.0.0.7bb447b1K8ArkN&algo_pvid=78744128-a393-4ffa-8d00-97da8deea121&algo_expid=78744128-a393-4ffa-8d00-97da8deea121-59&btsid=0bb0622916146398656028802e1b54&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_,searchweb201603_

and

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4000293171924.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.0.0.7bb447b1K8ArkN&algo_pvid=008432a4-041d-4e43-9f6e-c04118ac8aca&algo_expid=008432a4-041d-4e43-9f6e-c04118ac8aca-0&btsid=0b0a555716146409877875581e5f72&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_,searchweb201603_

I think these are the same.

Electricity: 220V 50 Hz, you need an adapter for the U.S. But .5 kw.

Some of the pictures show something like a rivet sticking out on the dresser - which I guess creates the hollow. Possibly steel, not a diamond point dressor, no way to adjust ROH that I see.

The hockey skate sharpening wheel looks crude. Not sure about sharpening quality.

No information available on replacing dressor or wheel!

7. https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4000293271460.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.0.0.72d047b1pFlein&algo_pvid=361250b4-3216-4897-812a-497eab982315&algo_expid=361250b4-3216-4897-812a-497eab982315-2&btsid=0bb0600116146424874991625e3720&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_,searchweb201603_

90 W = .12 hp input. Not much power.

8. https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4000511321711.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.0.0.7bb447b1K8ArkN&algo_pvid=008432a4-041d-4e43-9f6e-c04118ac8aca&algo_expid=008432a4-041d-4e43-9f6e-c04118ac8aca-7&btsid=0b0a555716146409877875581e5f72&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_,searchweb201603_

and

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005001703925798.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.0.0.72d047b1pFlein&algo_pvid=361250b4-3216-4897-812a-497eab982315&algo_expid=361250b4-3216-4897-812a-497eab982315-11&btsid=0bb0600116146424874991625e3720&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_,searchweb201603_

Quite a difference in price between 2 merchants.

220 V; Hz unspecified. How much power?

Dresser looks a bit crude. Perhaps the two wheels have different ROH?? But what ROH are they?

No information available on replacing dressor or wheel!

If only there were more details... But still seems dubious.

Holy smokes, those are crazy. I guess if you want people to hate skating, use one of these on their skates.

Bill_S · March 02, 2021, 09:25:06 AM

Quote10. Wissota 911 sharpener: https://wissota.com Starting at $1125 (+shipping?)

...

They cite $6/sharpening. Sounds high. I get maybe a hundred or more simple sharpenings out of a $100 Pro-Filer. But maybe if you only dress the wheel for one ROH, it is cheaper?

Hmmm. Material costs are much less than $6 per sharpening for the Wissota that you cited. A replacement grinding wheel is only $32, and you'll get hundreds of sharpenings from that. I suspect what you saw is the capital cost of a new machine amortized over a year or two for a hockey family. I will guarantee that it doesn't cost $6 in consumables per sharpening.

BTW, UPS shipping for my Wissota 911 "Deluxe" outfit plus accessories was ~$83. They almost always have a sale going on that makes up for that in freebies, or on unit discounts.

Bill_S · March 02, 2021, 09:39:59 AM

Query: I just recalled that I did the calculation for consumables when I first set up the machine in this thread - http://skatingforums.com/index.php?topic=8453.0

My estimate was 38 cents per sharpening.

tstop4me · March 02, 2021, 09:57:05 AM

Quote from: Query on March 01, 2021, 10:01:33 PM

10. Wissota 911 sharpener: https://wissota.com Starting at $1125 (+shipping?)

The video makes operation pretty clear.

You can adjust the ROH, rather than be stuck with one or two.

They cite $6/sharpening. Sounds high. I get maybe a hundred or more simple sharpenings out of a $100 Pro-Filer. But maybe if you only dress the wheel for one ROH, it is cheaper?

The $6/sharpening does not refer to expense of sharpening with the Wissota unit. The $6/sharpening is their reference for what it would cost to pay a skate tech and how quickly you could recoup the purchase price of a Wissota. The number is for hockey skates. I don't know what year and what region they are referencing. I don't think anyone in my area (NJ) charges anything that low these days, so that would make the Wissota an even better deal (and even more so for advanced figure skates, which skate techs in my area charge a lot more to sharpen than they do for hockey skates).

Query · March 02, 2021, 02:47:48 PM

Quote from: tstop4me on March 02, 2021, 09:57:05 AM
The $6/sharpening does not refer to expense of sharpening with the Wissota unit. The $6/sharpening is their reference for what it would cost to pay a skate tech and how quickly you could recoup the purchase price of a Wissota.

Oh. You are right! I didn't interpret the Wissota page right.

There are rinks here with $6 sharpenings, I think. I used to use one. Not good results.

Bill, why did you choose the Wissota unit over the roughly-same-cost Blademaster unit? Does it have advantages, or cheaper parts?

Anyway, my main point was that there are a lot of really bad sharpening devices out there.

Bill_S · March 02, 2021, 04:07:56 PM

Quote from: Query on March 02, 2021, 02:47:48 PM

Bill, why did you choose the Wissota unit over the roughly-same-cost Blademaster unit? Does it have advantages, or cheaper parts?

1. I didn't want a bench-top model that I'd have to lift on and off the bench, or a large console model, so the Wissota Deluxe with a vertical stand fit my cramped space better.

2. A great motor. I used industrial Leesons and Baldors a lot in my engineering days. The Wissota uses a Leeson.

3. Almost everything is made domestically for easy service and continued parts availability.

4. The people I talked to about ordering one were knowledgeable and helpful.

5. I liked their blade holders.

6. Good, simple "bones" to make tweaks for improvements straightforward.

Query · March 06, 2021, 11:03:45 PM

Sounds like you thought through what you wanted very carefully.

The AliExpress ones probably wouldn't meet any of your criteria. Especially if you don't speak Chinese.

I still think the best hand tools work very well, if you are willing to spend a few minutes/blade, and if you used a very-coarse (cylindrical) stone to make major changes in rocker or hollow (much coarser than the ones included with Pro-Filer, or even the Berghman), perhaps they could be reasonably efficient even for that. I keep meaning to try it.

News:

Some really dubious skate sharpeners :)