Coaching Requirements

[Skittl1321]

Query...the Usfsa now requires coaches to be green lighted to put students on the ice.at any test or sanctioned event. This didn't used to be the case.

Isi coaches must be.professional ISI members to do the same.

An uncredentialed coach can teach just fine, but lacks.the ability.to.fully do their job due to these restrictions.

[Query]

JPeople who find skating easy can't necessarily explain it to others.

Some certified coaches aren't good with students either.

Just like school teachers.

Usfsa now requires coaches to be green lighted to put students on the ice.at any test or sanctioned event... Isi coaches must be.professional ISI members to do the same.

Which is why I said

Perhaps you or the student coach could arrange for another coach with the appropriate coach membership to officially take your DD through the test or competition.

That seems to be the way some same-gender ice dance coaches do it.

Is there still an option to test or compete with no coach be your own coach, like Kwan did for a while?

What does "green lighted" mean - a professional member, a certified professional member, or certified to coach students at that test or competition level?

[Skittl1321]

Green lighted is the term USFSA uses to say the paperwork is approved.  It involves a background check, joining PSA (only required for A level, recommended for B),  USFSA, and completing the necessary CER for the level. ("A" level for qualifying, "B" level for local,  "C" level is Basic Skills, IIRC.)

There is nothing that says a coach has any ability, except they passed the, online, open book, exams.


Many adults compete without a coach, but technically a coach (and a club official, if you are not an indvidiual member) has to sign entry forms and test forms.  This actually started after Kwan snuck off and took her senior test without her coach knowing.  I don't think as a direct result of her, though.  So even if you attend without a coach, a coach needs to sign.  When I had a non-credentialed coach, I just asked another coach in the rink to sign my papers.  They usually asked to see my program, to make sure their name wasn't being attached to something not suitable for putting out there.  They did not attend the event with me.

There is no requirement of a coach signing off on an international competition though, so an elite skater could still go to those without a coach  Not sure how entering Nationals works, but I'd assume since you need a signature for regionals, you'd need one for nationals, but maybe not if you got a 'bye'.

[Clarice]

Not sure how entering Nationals works, but I'd assume since you need a signature for regionals, you'd need one for nationals, but maybe not if you got a 'bye'.

No, you don't need a signature to enter Regionals, since you do it on line.  The purpose of a coach's signature on a test or competition form is so that the coach will know what events and level the skater signed up for and can make corrections if necessary.  US Figure Skating's on line registration system doesn't allow you to enter at your wrong test level, so a coach doesn't need to verify.

I personally don't think it would be ethical for me, as a certified coach, to take someone else's skater to a test or competition to cover for their lack of certification.  I also wouldn't want to be coach of record for someone I hadn't actually taught.  I took a dance student through a test once, but she came and worked with me for a month before the test so we did have a short-term coach/student relationship.

As a parent, I would want my skater's coach to be certified because I want the assurance that they carry liability insurance.  I also like that a background check is done, although I know that things can still slip through cracks.  If the skater is going to be testing/competing, the coach absolutely needs to have the proper credentials.  It's not that difficult to do, but does require paying for memberships/insurance/tests, which is why some people don't want to do it.

[Query]

It seems to me that any almost instructor serious about making a living at this would join and would probably get certified. The referral should be easy for a good skater to get. Few rinks would allow someone who didn't have the right credentials to do group lessons, and group lessons are so often used to recruit private students.

I've looked at the PSA BS training materials. They are easy to understand. Given a few hours, I could pass, despite that there are moves I am physically unable to do. If other PSA materials are as well written, certification at lower levels isn't that big a deal.

My coach is a college student too, with few students. She complains she has to pay for professional memberships in ISI, USFSA and PSA to meet her rink requirements. But she belongs and is certified.

[hopskipjump]

I don't think and child would put themselves on the ice at regionals. 

To use entryeeze you must provide a coach name.  Either from the drop down list or hand enter.  You cannot bypass that screen.

To be the coach at the comp "Coaches/Professionals who wish to accompany their skaters rinkside must provide a photo ID (drivers license or passport) and their USFS Membership card to receive their credential."

[Isk8NYC]

No, you don't need a signature to enter Regionals, since you do it on line.

Entry-Eeze and other online registration systems send the coach a confirmation email.  The skater cannot compete in that category if the coach disapproves the entry.  The skater could put "Independent" or list themselves, I guess.

[Query]

It would be hard for a student to ice dance test with a coach who's style they were unfamiliar with. There is a huge difference between coaches who put a foot or more between their bodies and their partner, and who look directly into their partner's eyes, and those who dance hip to hip and cheek to cheek. Add left/right tracking variations, differences in torso and head rotation, and timing, and it's confusing for those of us who have changed coaches even under the best circumstances.

Presumably JUDGE certification is VERY difficult, because a coach who taught one style has to learn to judge other styles. And they don't even make a living at it.

If I were a skater's parent, I would definitely want a background check. It's scary that is new.

[Skittl1321]

It seems to me that any almost instructor serious about making a living at this would join and would probably get certified. The referral should be easy for a good skater to get. Few rinks would allow someone who didn't have the right credentials to do group lessons, and group lessons are so often used to recruit private students.

It seems that most coaches don't make their primary living at this.  At least not around here.    For those with just a few students, it really does put a burden on the coaches.  I offered my current coach to pay his club fees (he is a member of another club) when we had to move my lesson to club ice.  As his only student on club ice, it cost him 3 of my lessons to join the club, just to teach me.  That is beyond all his other registration.


None of our LTS-only coaches have had their background checks done.  I'm not sure how the rink gets away with that. Maybe because the system is new?  Or because no one checks up on it?  It used to be that you paid the $14 "basic skills instructor" fee and were done with it, and that is all they still do.  The USFS website makes it sound like this isn't sufficient any longer.

[Skittl1321]

Presumably JUDGE certification is VERY difficult, because a coach who taught one style has to learn to judge other styles.

Judge certification requires trial judging, and appointments to judge various levels/disciplines based on your mastery of learning to judge that event.  It is very different from being a coach.

[Clarice]

Entry-Eeze and other online registration systems send the coach a confirmation email.  The skater cannot compete in that category if the coach disapproves the entry.  The skater could put "Independent" or list themselves, I guess.

Okay, I stand corrected.  It's been a long time since my skater competed!  I have a coach, whose name I enter for Adult Nationals, but I thought that was only so that they would receive their credentials.  I don't know why anybody would want to compete without a coach, but I didn't think there was any rule "requiring" you to have one. 

[AgnesNitt]

Query...the Usfsa now requires coaches to be green lighted to put students on the ice.at any test or sanctioned event. This didn't used to be the case.

Isi coaches must be.professional ISI members to do the same.

An uncredentialed coach can teach just fine, but lacks.the ability.to.fully do their job due to these restrictions.

You're posting from your hiccupping puppy of an android phone aren't you?

[sarahspins]

There is nothing that says a coach has any ability, except they passed the, online, open book, exams.

No, but being a member of PSA typically means that a coach carries liability insurance and has agreed to follow a code of ethics - that's something at least.

I went through the USFSA background check recently and the background check is now a $21 fee *in addition to the $12 basic skills membership*... you can do it entirely online.  My rink also requires their own background check before employment which they pay for - even if you are an unpaid volunteer.

I did my CER-C in about an hour.. it was way too easy IMO, but then again it's free, so I can't truly complain much.

[techskater]

Okay, I stand corrected.  It's been a long time since my skater competed!  I have a coach, whose name I enter for Adult Nationals, but I thought that was only so that they would receive their credentials.  I don't know why anybody would want to compete without a coach, but I didn't think there was any rule "requiring" you to have one. 

US Qualifying entries is different than Entry-eez for some reason as I never enter my coaches' info for ANs/Sectionals (since they have so many skaters going) and I bypass that screen.

[Skittl1321]

Query - What certification do you think coaches get?

All the things you listed are what makes a coach certified.

[jjane45]

(Though I still think it makes professional sense for a coach to be certified.)

At my ISI dominant rink, a great full-time coach I know only gets ISI credentials, as only one student competes USFS and it's not economical to put up hundreds of $$ for USFS credentials. I am not sure how USFS testing goes.

[Query]

Query - What certification do you think coaches get?

Perhaps I am confused between passing the PSA CER-B courses, and passing PSA ratings exams at the "Certified" level.

What does "certified" mean to you? (In a skatings sense, not at an asylum).

The only thing you need even CER courses for is to test and compete - not any of the other things I mentioned. (Reference: http://usfsa.org/Content/Coaches%20Requirement%20Chart.pdf)

And you don't need PSA ratings (see also http://www.skatepsa.com/Ratings.htm) unless you go to qualifying competitions - like sectional, regional or national championships - which only a small fraction of skaters do. It doesn't make psychological sense for a skater to go to qualifying competitions unless it looks like they will do well. It isn't necessary to get a coach certified for qualifying competitions otherwise.

Many of us have found that the coaches who are best for elite athletes - such as skaters who should go to qualifying competitions - are most often not very good at teaching normal people.

REVISED to add:

But you are right. According to the coach requirements doce, in the CER course sense, you need to be "certified" to take a student to a test or competition.

In addition, a skater might have competed very well 5 or 10 years ago, but be unfamiliar with the USFSA rule changes since then. (I don't pretend to understand why the rules keep changing, or the point values of moves, and the GOE standards, change so often.) So, as a coach, they might teach their students to do the wrong things. Hopefully the "continuing education" requirements to maintain certification takes care of some of that. Maybe a student/coach who doesn't take the time to get certified in the CER sense, also doesn't take the time to look at and memorize rule changes.

[techskater]

There are hundreds of skaters who go to Regionals at the Juvenile and higher level every year.  In my Region alone, there are typically between 85 and 120 Intermediate ladies. Each of these skaters needs a coach who has the proper CERs and background check (which aren't cheap and the tests for the CERs are time consuming and in some cases poorly written ::cough, cough, IJS test, cough, cough::  Also, adult skaters going to a qualifying part of sectionals who bring there coach must also have the proper CERs. 

[Skittl1321]

Query- I consider a certified coach someone who can get USFSA credentials at a non-basic skills competition.  This is someone on the coaches list that USFSA puts out.  It has nothing to do with PSA ratings.  I guess the term USFSA uses is "compliant" not certified.
http://www.usfsa.org/Content/web%20report_state_2012.pdf


And even non-qualifying competitons require a CER level (B).  Our local competition used to allow parents to put their kids on the ice, now they can't do that due to new requirements.  (The club skirted this by setting up a table as a barrier. Only coaches were allowed on the right side of the barrier.  If a parent was putting their skater on the ice, they had to stand to the left, not directly at the door.)  So you need to be a compliant coach to even take kids to the "fun" competitions, where there are 3 kids per event, and they do silly events with props, not just serious stuff.



-------------------
And there are TONS of skaters who go to regionals with no chance of advancing.  So I don't agree it doesn't make sense to go if you won't do well.   

[jjane45]

I'm curious for USFS rinks in general, what percentage of rink staff coaches is USFS compliant. A quick glance at my state in the pdf above, my ISI rink's stats are even lower than I expected.

[techskater]

What level of compliance? I'd say 80% of the coaches at our rink are at least CER-B compliant an probably at least 67% of those are also CER-A (because they have kids and/or adults going to qualifying competitions)

[jjane45]

I'm curious for USFS rinks in general, what percentage of rink staff coaches is USFS compliant. A quick glance at my state in the pdf above, my ISI rink's stats are even lower than I expected.

Let me take it back. Upon a closer look, approximately half of our coaches are CER-A and one CER-B. Almost all Russian coaches are compliant (no surprise here). All dance coaches are compliant. Adult friendly coaches and synchro coaches are much less likely compliant (very surprised at few of them). Junior coaches are not compliant. Interesting!

[Clarice]

Nobody's going to be USFS compliant unless they need to be, because it costs money.  I think that explains the pattern at jjane's rink.  Junior coaches wouldn't put skaters on for tests or competitions.  A lot of adults don't test or compete, so coaches with lots of adult students are less likely to need the certification.  Synchro coaches would need certification, but not if the team only competes ISI.  All coaches should have liability insurance, whether or not they are CER compliant.

At my rink, 5 coaches have at least CER-B.  One more has insurance, but is not otherwise USFS compliant - she only teaches group classes and private lessons to recreational skaters.  The high school and college kids who teach group classes are not registered; we'll have to take a look at what is required for them and make sure it happens this year.  The rink was not good about this, and I don't think they were even registered as Basic Skills instructors, and so didn't have liability coverage.

[Skittl1321]

I wouldn't worry if a ISI coach isn't on that list.  It is a USFS list!  If they take kids to ISI competitions they have to be professional members of ISI.  They may even be PSA members.

We are a USFS club (the "rink" is not USFS, USFS is not a rink organization like ISI is, unless the club has chosen to organize that way- ie owns the rink) and to coach on club ice, you must be compliant.  Therefore, pretty much every freestyle coach at our rink is compliant.  Like I said, I don't think any of the Basic Skills only coaches have had background checks, I know this because I haven't- and the rink lists me as a coach (I don't anymore, and will be taken off the list) when I told the director I hadn't done that yet, she looked at me like I was crazy.  We have a coach who does occasional privates, but only on public ice, that is not compliant.  She only appears every few months, and has one or two students.

[phoenix]

Nobody's going to be USFS compliant unless they need to be, because it costs money.

And by that, she means a LOT of money. My total bill (including a rink fee to teach for the year of $175) will be about $500.00. I'm CER B--don't have students going to qualifying comps, so I don't do A.  For a new or junior coach who may only have 1 or 2 students to begin with, that's a pretty huge chunk of change & will take a long time to earn back. USFSA / PSA doesn't make it easy to become a coach, for beginning coaches who are just getting started.

Anyway, as another poster said, the certification/compliance says absolutely nothing about someone's ability to coach--the CER tests are pretty lame. PSA ratings, on the other hand, would be a better guide, but they're very expensive to do & keep. Most coaches don't do them.