Moves on temporary mounts + waterproofing under the blade

[sampaguita]

What moves are safe to do on temporary mounts? I know jumps and spins are out, but how about turns, crossovers, stroking, etc? Is there a limit to how fast you can skate or how deep you ride an edge into a turn? All the pros are busy right now with an upcoming competition, so I'm looking at 6-12 hours of skating on temporary mounts.

My skates haven't been chemically re-treated and the blades are still on temporary mount. However, since I had to skate in them to test my customized insole, I decided to just Sno-seal the skates. The heels are easy to Sno-seal, and I wouldn't mind having to sno-seal them repeatedly over the year. What I'm worried about is underneath the blade -- will the plastic coating on the Jackson Freestyle lose effectiveness eventually? If so, how do I waterproof that part without removing the blade?

[Skittl1321]

My fitter told me I could jump on my temporary mounts, just don't do doubles.  I don't do doubles anyway. 
I found that for my level of skating, I had no limits at all on them.  I was able to do everything just fine.  It was about 4-6 months before I went back to her to have the other screws put in (basically, she just noticed at a sharpening she hadn't done it yet.)

I've never bothered waterproofing beneath the blades, just around them the best I could.  Which reminds me. I should probably re-snow seal my boots.

[CrossStroke]

Hah, I got my boots in August 2010, and am still skating on 5 screws/sole or so (don't have skates nearby to double-check).  Granted, lately I spend just 2-3 hours on the ice per week.  Working on Novice moves.  No jumping, other than occasional single loops when I am in the mood.

Yeah, I am getting a few more screws in very soon (not all, maybe 2-3 more per boot), as I think one hole got stripped

[sarahspins]

Our fitter that moved away last year would let skaters do triples on temp mounts... so I'm not convinced that jumping and spinning on temp mounts always means impending doom or that it's actually that dangerous.  The key is that you shouldn't keep doing it for weeks and months, but keeping the temp mounting enough so that you can fully test out the blades is not going to be a problem, and 6-12 hours should be more than fine.  I was doing all my jumps and spins and had even been on the harness doing doubles on temporary mounts when I switched over to my paramounts (I did put more screws in after about two weeks).  Nothing bad happened

Jacksons don't really need waterproofing under the blades because of that layer they put on the bottom of their soles - you would be fine just treating the heels and sides of the sole.  There was no water damage underneath my old blades when I took them off - just a few small rust marks that wiped away.

On my daughter's 6-7 year old Freestyles that I just put new blades on, there was also no damage under the blades... the only water damage to the soles was at the edges around the toes. However I should also say that I never re-waterproofed them when I got them 6ish months ago and I probably should have (I did sno-seal them twice when I had the blades off).  We weren't the first owners, obviously, and odds are good there was already some damage.  I'm only looking to get as much time as I can until she outgrows them though (which could be in 6 weeks, or 6 months), or I'd be more worried about it.

[VAsk8r]

I found that for my level of skating, I had no limits at all on them.  I was able to do everything just fine.  It was about 4-6 months before I went back to her to have the other screws put in (basically, she just noticed at a sharpening she hadn't done it yet.)

When I got my first pair of Freestyles, I had no idea there even was such a thing as a temp mount, and I skated on them for probably six months before my coach noticed and made me get a perm mount. Unfortunately, she found out because I commented to her that my blade was loose. I don't know how long I'd been on a loose blade, but it took me a couple of weeks, at least, to adjust after they were permanently mounted.

I have new skates, and after my third time skating in them, my coach noticed I still had the temporary mount. "You need to get those perm mounted before you start jumping!" she squawked. Oops.

[sampaguita]

Thanks for all your inputs! Although I have another problem now with the waterproofing -- my blade guards (Guardog?) are rubbing against the sole, near the toe pick, and it's peeling the plastic film off! Has anyone ever encountered this before? I'm thinking of sno-sealing that part once the boots dry.

[sarahspins]

I've never had that happen... are you putting them on backwards?  Even on my daughter's skates with much lower stanchions than mine the guards don't touch the sole.

[sampaguita]

The blade guards that I use are asymmetrical -- I put the larger end at the heel, and the shorter one at the toe. Did I put it right?

When I put the guards on, there's no rubbing or anything, but if you apply any pressure on the blade guards (such as while walking), the guards slide up, rubbing against the boot. My boot is 9 in long, and the blade guards are cut to 230 mm (it says so on the markings), so I don't know exactly what's wrong...

[hopskipjump]

RE guards - dd only like gel guard dog skate guards.  Some are harder and crack and don't fit as well.  She had a pair from a different brand that rubbed the toe like you are describing.

[Sk8tmum]

The blade guards that I use are asymmetrical -- I put the larger end at the heel, and the shorter one at the toe. Did I put it right?

When I put the guards on, there's no rubbing or anything, but if you apply any pressure on the blade guards (such as while walking), the guards slide up, rubbing against the boot. My boot is 9 in long, and the blade guards are cut to 230 mm (it says so on the markings), so I don't know exactly what's wrong...

It happens; yes, you are putting them on right (big in the back).  What you can do is get an exacto knife, or a saw if you like, and trim the toe part down a bit.

I would also check to see that you've assembled them correctly.  Correctly, they shouldn't shift at all on the blades; you have sufficient tension in the spring that they pull together and are quite immovable.  You say that your boot is 9 inches long - do you mean the blade? the guards are cut to fit the blade length, not the bootlength.

[sampaguita]

I would also check to see that you've assembled them correctly.  Correctly, they shouldn't shift at all on the blades; you have sufficient tension in the spring that they pull together and are quite immovable.  You say that your boot is 9 inches long - do you mean the blade? the guards are cut to fit the blade length, not the bootlength.

Sorry, yes, the BLADE is 9 in long. The guards don't shift horizontally, just vertically.

RE guards - dd only like gel guard dog skate guards.  Some are harder and crack and don't fit as well.  She had a pair from a different brand that rubbed the toe like you are describing.

I'm also using Guardog skate guards. I don't know if it's Gelz, Glitz, or Pearlz though. Is there a difference in the shapes of the 3 models?

[hopskipjump]

I don't think so...it's just the gels seem to be softer - more flexible.

[Query]

Wow. Triple jumps in temporary mounts...

I guess you know that the only force preventing sideways motion in the slot holes used for temporary mounts is the friction from the very tight screw, whereas a screw in a countersunk round hole puts a well anchored piece of metal in the way. So if you skate long enough for the screws to loosen, they will slip.

How many jumps did your tech have you try on the temporary mounts? I bet not many.

If you landed much short, on any kind of jump, that seems like a lot of sideways force trying to make the slot slip. So do you need very good jump landings, to try jumps on temporary mounts?

I can't imagine a coach or tech advising someone to do a test or competition on temporary mounts. Equipment failure shouldn't have to be a reason someone is disappointed with the results.

[VAsk8r]

I guess you know that the only force preventing sideways motion in the slot holes used for temporary mounts is the friction from the very tight screw, whereas a screw in a countersunk round hole puts a well anchored piece of metal in the way. So if you skate long enough for the screws to loosen, they will slip.

My coach told me her blade actually fell off once while she was jumping. I have no idea how many screws she had in there or what kind of jump it was. I had forgotten that story until I read your post.

[sampaguita]

Here's a picture of my skates with blade guards on. Are they cut to the right size? They're rubbing on BOTH the toe and the heel of the boot...



Thanks!

[Query]

I can't think of any reason the guard needs to touch the toe or heel. So I'd trim it.

[sampaguita]

I can't think of any reason the guard needs to touch the toe or heel. So I'd trim it.

Trim where? The top of the guards, or along the length of the guards? I'm not exactly sure my guards are of the right length, but I've tried lengthening it and it seems that the guards will come off. Where should the top of the guards end, anyway?

[hopskipjump]

The front fits to the blade plate.  It doesn't come up over the blade plate.  In the back there is about a centimeter between the guard and the heel.

Ignore the white dots on the guard - we put dd's name on everything.

[sarahspins]

Your guards are cut too long.. I can tell because the heel of your blade isn't sitting all the way down in the back as it would be if they were tight.  If you trim them shorter (in the middle) you'll make them fit the blade tighter and then they won't have any way to move. 

It's fine if there is a small gap in the middle guards when they are on your blades... mine have about a 1/4" gap in the middle, and my daughter's are about 1/2" since she's gone up a size in blades with the same guards.

[sampaguita]

Your guards are cut too long.. I can tell because the heel of your blade isn't sitting all the way down in the back as it would be if they were tight.  If you trim them shorter (in the middle) you'll make them fit the blade tighter and then they won't have any way to move. 

If I trim them in the middle, won't that make the guards touch the heel and toe more? Currently, there's no "1cm" clearance between the heel and the guards...

[Sk8tmum]

If I trim them in the middle, won't that make the guards touch the heel and toe more? Currently, there's no "1cm" clearance between the heel and the guards...

When my DD was very tiny, she desperately wanted a pair of these guards, but, they were too "high" in the same way that yours are.  Our skate guy trimmed the tops of the "upturns" at the end of the blades so that they fit nicely under the boot and they worked well.

Looking at your blades, you have a bit of a "short stancion" which is the part between the blade and the boot.  The guards are thus too "high" on the ends for your boots; I've seen this on a couple of kids with Pattern 99's which are also short stancioned, and particularly if they blades are not mounted end to end (i.e. if there's a bit of a gap between the sole and heel plates and the tip end of the boots; can't tell if that's present on your skates).  Just trim off the upturns a bit and you'll be fine.

In terms of whether they're too long ... tug on them a bit when they're on the blades. If you don't have a really strong resistance, then, yes, you're probably cut too long; their should be no "give" without tension being felt on the spring. 

[sampaguita]

When my DD was very tiny, she desperately wanted a pair of these guards, but, they were too "high" in the same way that yours are.  Our skate guy trimmed the tops of the "upturns" at the end of the blades so that they fit nicely under the boot and they worked well.

Looking at your blades, you have a bit of a "short stancion" which is the part between the blade and the boot.  The guards are thus too "high" on the ends for your boots; I've seen this on a couple of kids with Pattern 99's which are also short stancioned, and particularly if they blades are not mounted end to end (i.e. if there's a bit of a gap between the sole and heel plates and the tip end of the boots; can't tell if that's present on your skates).  Just trim off the upturns a bit and you'll be fine.

In terms of whether they're too long ... tug on them a bit when they're on the blades. If you don't have a really strong resistance, then, yes, you're probably cut too long; their should be no "give" without tension being felt on the spring. 

Thanks for this! I think I have exactly the same case. I had considered just cutting the upturns, but I was worried that it might affect the fit a bit. Thanks for sharing your experience.

I checked my skates, and yes, there's a gap between the edge of the heel plate and the edge of the boot, so the blades are not mounted end to end. There's a lot of resistance when I try to pull the guards away. :-)