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Author Topic: MK Professional, Wilson Coronation Ace or Wilson Four Aces? HELP, please!  (Read 3508 times)

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Offline Bladina

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Dear all,
I'm a new entry

I'm dealing with an incredible challenge: I need a new pair of skates and, I can't decide what it is better for me! :p

I would define my skating level as "intermediate": I can jump single axel, clean doubles salchow, rit, toe-loop and not so clean double lutz and double flip.

I would go in Risport RF2 standard (NOT Super, I'm thin and not so tall, so my teacher told me that RF2 Super could be really tough for me) but I can't decide for blades.

The shop assistant suggested me these 3 options:

1. MK Professional (220 euro)
2. Wilson Coronation Ace (200 euro)
3. Wilson Four Aces (240 euro)

Through a basic comparison I've tryed to do in these hours, the only difference I see is that MK Pro and Wilson Cor. Ace have got the cross-cut pick, whereas Wilson Four Aces has got the straight-cut pick.

Any other differences????

In your opinion, what could be the right choice for me?
Thank you in advance for helping me to decide!


(My *very* old skates are Risport RF3 + MK Club 2000)

Offline FigureSpins

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Re: MK Professional, Wilson Coronation Ace ore Wilson Four Aces? HELP, please!
« Reply #1 on: December 22, 2010, 10:07:54 AM »
Definitely time to step up to freestyle skates - congrats!

I don't know anyone who uses Four Aces blades, sorry, so I can't give you any advice about them.

The MK Professionals and JW Coronation Aces are indeed very similar in materials and rocker radius/profile.  It's really only the toe rake that differs.  Choose the Coronation Ace and save the 20 euros for new blade guards, lol.

Interesting that there's a price differential, those two blades usually cost the same amount here in the US.

Good luck with whatever choice you make!
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Offline HollyGlit

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Re: MK Professional, Wilson Coronation Ace ore Wilson Four Aces? HELP, please!
« Reply #2 on: December 22, 2010, 04:04:26 PM »
Hi! Thank You for your reply! :)

Ok, leaving away the Four Aces just for a while, could you help me to better understand what I saw this afternoon at the shop about these peculiarities? Thank you in advance!!!!!! :)


TOE RAKE

MK Professional blade has got the smaller Toe Rake dimension respect to other two blades. It is slightly shorter than the JW Coronation Ace one and shorter enough than the JW Four Aces one.
Sincerely, I don't know the meaning of having a shorter or longer Toe Rake dimension  ... are you more skilled than me?! 

CUT PICK
MK Professional and JW Coronation Ace have got a cross-cut pick. JW Four Aces has got a straight Pick.
I suppose that a cross-cut pick should help you in the toe-jumps, even if the shop assistant told that, practically, there is no difference.
mumble mumble...

FIRST UPPER TOOTH

MK Professional has got the most prominent tooth and has got an evident curve profile (like a bump) between the first Tooth and the point of attack to the Toe Plate. On the contrary, both JW blades have got a smoother profile (it is almost linear, not so bumped) and a less prominent First Tooth.

I think this is one of the main (and important?) feature/peculiarity of the blades but I don't know what it means. I suppose it is useful in the toe-jumps, but I'm not skilled enough to understand what is better or what is more useful for one person and for another one. Please, help me!

DRAG PICK (LAST LOWER TOOTH)

What I've noted is that, generally, JW blades (both Coronation Ace and Four Aces) have got a Drag Pick more curved to the bottom. MK Professional, on the contrary, has got a Drag Pick more "plain".
Obviously,  I don't know anything about the usefulness of having a prominent drag pick or not... sorry

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Re: MK Professional, Wilson Coronation Ace ore Wilson Four Aces? HELP, please!
« Reply #3 on: December 22, 2010, 04:39:56 PM »
I can't comment on the drag pick and the size and shape of the first pick.
But I've been told that the cross-cut toe-pick helps to grip the ice better than a straight cut toe-pick.
I've just switched from a straight cut to a cross cut in the last week and can't really notice the difference but I'm only doing single jumps. Possibly it helps more with doubles.

I've just switched from ISE Sterling to Ultima Legacy. They're both meant to be equivalent to a Coronation Ace but from differing manufacturers and the biggest thing I've noticed is the difference in rocker profile. The Sterlings  were a lot flatter and so you had to be more precise with spins to get them centred. So whilst toe pick size and shape is important, I'd compare the different blades to the profile of your current ones as the rocker is going to have a bigger affect on your skating. Although, if your current blades are old and worn down, the rocker is likely to be flattened so switching to any new blade is going to affect your skating (and improve it once you get over the rocking).


Offline Sierra

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Re: MK Professional, Wilson Coronation Ace ore Wilson Four Aces? HELP, please!
« Reply #4 on: December 22, 2010, 05:07:13 PM »
The space between the pick and the toe plate is non significant. Some blades are convex, or curved, there, and some are concave. It's just looks- doesn't affect picking in at all.

There's really not a difference between cross cut and straight cut. I think that cross cut might pick a little shallower, because I never leave big holes, yet other skaters do.. but I very rarely slip off the pick or anything.

I have Coronation Aces. I totally vouch for them. They have a great sharpening life, and I adjusted very quickly to them, especially considering that I was too low level for them when I got them.

I'm working on axel and four doubles, so same as you (except I'm not landing them yet :P)

Go ahead and get the Aces, since they're the cheapest.

Offline Sk8tmum

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Re: MK Professional, Wilson Coronation Ace ore Wilson Four Aces? HELP, please!
« Reply #5 on: December 22, 2010, 05:33:22 PM »
There is a difference between cross-cut and straight-cut (you can hunt the forums here for a lot of discussions about them). The cross-cut is more "forgiving" as you have multiple "faces" to grasp the ice on a pick jump. The straight cut (the JW Coro Comet is the more common straight cut Wilson blade) requires more precise toe-spotting because you have to put those picks straight into the ice; if you're off-kilter, it's harder to get a good grab on the ice.

I will attest, from the experience of my own children, that going from a straight-cut blade to a cross-cut blade gave them better pick jumps, however, they also have pointed out to me that their coaches working with them on very good pick technique on the straight cut blades meant that their pick technique was already good, and that they then could "wiggle" a bit of forgiveness out, when they made an error, due to the cross-cut factor.  I chatted with our skate gurus about this, and they agreed in the logic with the analysis that my kids presented.

Have you visited the Wilson site? They've got an excellent catalogue of their blades. They do note that the Four Aces is basically the same level as the Coro Comet, but with the "subtle difference" of the straight cut picks.

OUt of curiosity: what were your old blades? That should factor into your decision ... did you like them, did they work for you, etc. And, what does your coach recommend? S/he seems to have definite opinions on boots, bet s/he would have advice on the blade ... :)

http://www.johnwilsonskates.com/

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Re: MK Professional, Wilson Coronation Ace ore Wilson Four Aces? HELP, please!
« Reply #6 on: December 22, 2010, 09:26:41 PM »
Just get the Coronation Ace - this is a blade that can be worn by all levels of skating and it has been around for a LONG time -

You will like them just fine.
 ;D
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Offline HollyGlit

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Re: MK Professional, Wilson Coronation Ace ore Wilson Four Aces? HELP, please!
« Reply #7 on: December 23, 2010, 03:54:42 AM »
Hi!
Really Thank you for your interesting replies :)

About my old blades, at the beginning I started with Risport RF4 + MK 21, then after 5 months, I switched to RF3.

My current blade is 2 years old, but it is very very used. It is not able to keep the sharpening and the last tooth is very very consumed (so, my spin rocker is very consumed as well).

Honestly, I have to say that my coach told me to change my blades last year, but I've tried to use them one year more.
And honestly as well, maybe I've always been using lower blades compared to my skating level.

I'm trying to consider Four Aces, the shop assistant told me that they could be better in keeping the sharpening. I don' t know...

Offline Bladina

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Re: MK Professional, Wilson Coronation Ace ore Wilson Four Aces? HELP, please!
« Reply #8 on: December 26, 2010, 12:23:30 PM »
Hi! Best Wishes!!!

Underneath my Christmas three, yesterday night, I found... a new pair of skates from my boyfriend!
A wonderful pair of Risport RF2 + JW Four Aces!

But now, I have a question. I've just noted that the size of my boot is 245 and the size of my blade is 9 1/2.

I've checked on this website

http://www.skatetrix.ch/MK-Wilson-Blades/MK-Wilson-size-E_index.html

and noted that, if my sole is 245, the correct size of blades should be 9.1/4. Surfing o other websites, they told that the correct size would be 9.1/4 or 9.1/3.

9.1/2 would be for skate size 250.

What do you think about it? Should a keep my boots+blades as they are or I have to ask for a smaller size?
Thank you in advance and merry christmas again!!!!
bye bye!!!!!!

Offline Sk8tmum

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Re: MK Professional, Wilson Coronation Ace ore Wilson Four Aces? HELP, please!
« Reply #9 on: December 26, 2010, 01:27:36 PM »
Take them to whoever you have mounting your blades and ask. But, I would think that you need a smaller blade size.

Offline Isk8NYC

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Re: MK Professional, Wilson Coronation Ace ore Wilson Four Aces? HELP, please!
« Reply #10 on: December 26, 2010, 01:55:52 PM »
Most fitters prefer that the blade be 1/4" shorter than the boot length, with the gap behind the heel.  Others prefer the blade be the same length as the boot sole.  Personally, I prefer the 1/4" shorter, but Klingbeil's likes the full length.

Go to the shop where the skates were purchased and ask before you use them or get them sharpened.
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Offline Bladina

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Re: MK Professional, Wilson Coronation Ace ore Wilson Four Aces? HELP, please!
« Reply #11 on: December 27, 2010, 03:05:40 PM »
ok, I have measured my boots and my blades.

Boots are exactly 245 mm
Blades are exactly 243 mm (9.5)

CASE 1: then, if i get these blades, the distance between the end of the blade and the heel is 2 mm
CASE 2:otherwise, if I get the other blades (9.25), the distance becomes 8.5 mm

according to the "ideal distance", the max distance should be 0.25 less, so, the ideal distance for my skates would be 238.5

in CASE 1, the distance is 243
IDEAL DISTANCE is 238.5
in CASE 2, the distance would be 236.5

so... I have to do... what??! ??? I'd like to ask my couach, but she is away and it is very difficult to contact her via phone.

Help please!  :)

Offline Bladina

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Re: MK Professional, Wilson Coronation Ace ore Wilson Four Aces? HELP, please!
« Reply #12 on: December 27, 2010, 08:15:49 PM »
Hi! Here a picture of my boots + blades!

1° PICTURE
You can see the heel and the end of my blade. Just 2 mm from the end of the blade and the end of the heel.
If you say that it could be ok, I will be more relaxed.

In the end, on Risport website, I've found a Chart dedicated to Wilson Blades (Four Aces included) and Boots size.

http://www.risport.it/?IDsezione=22193

For boots 245, suggestions for blades are 9.1/4...

I'm so confused... I'd like to skate with my new skates, sob!!!

2° PICTURE
The full heel + blade + letters in ochre

Just Another question about blades: I used to have MK blades the the logo and the name of blades are engraved on the blade so, if you touch the blade, you feel the hollow on every letter.
Now I have a JW Four Aces and it seems to me very different: letters are simply "printed", not engraved, on the blade and are painted in ochre brown, not black.
Is it normal?


Thank you in advance :)

Offline Bill_S

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Re: MK Professional, Wilson Coronation Ace ore Wilson Four Aces? HELP, please!
« Reply #13 on: December 27, 2010, 08:35:00 PM »
Your blades fit the same as mine do. The back mounting plate is within a couple millimeters of the end of my heel. Nothing wrong with that.



My logo is also the same as yours - it's not engraved. Cost saving measure, I assume.
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Offline Isk8NYC

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Re: MK Professional, Wilson Coronation Ace ore Wilson Four Aces? HELP, please!
« Reply #14 on: December 27, 2010, 09:16:21 PM »
Just to chime in a minute- don't assume that online boot-to-blade size charts are always correct.  They're only estimates.  Manufacturing changes and variations can cause sole length to vary.  Fitters usually check the boot fit first, then measure the sole for blade length.
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Offline HollyGlit

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Re: MK Professional, Wilson Coronation Ace ore Wilson Four Aces? HELP, please!
« Reply #15 on: January 03, 2011, 08:13:30 AM »
Dear all,
first, happy new year and then... thank you for your suggestions about my skates :)

I've tried them and a new world is now open for me. Al my doubles have come correctly and closed and the rotation is perfect now. I wouldn't have thought a thing like this before.

Actually, my first 15 minutes on ice have been a hell and I have thought I was wrong by choosing this kind of blade. But, after having taken confidence with them, my spins started to come and I left away my fear of jumping with new blades.
Now I'm satisfied because my rotation has become faster and, in my opinion, it depens on the way I pick the ice.
Previoulsy, I used to pick the ice strongly and my leg used to do a big arc before picking the ice. Now, I need less power and less movement to pick the ice and everything looks easier to me.

I'm not so convinced just about the lenght of my blade because it seems to me that I am less smooth on the ice and it is more difficult to make the blades go where I want. Previously, that was one of my peculiarity.

I have to go now, I'l write you soon!