Changing Blades?

[Jamie]

Hi everyone!

I've been reading for a long time, but this is my first post.

I skated when I was younger (not to a high level) and have been skating again since June and with a coach since September. I am landing salchows, toe loops, and loops (mostly) and working on flips and lutzs. I'm also working on one-foot spins, backspins, and sit spins, but none of them are very good. I don't feel like I've ever found the sweet spot on my blades and I don't feel like I have much control when spinning.

I'm 5'3" and 140 lbs, wearing Jackson Freestyles and the Ultima Mark IV blades that came with them (with a 1/2" ROH at the moment). I'm very happy with the boot, but I'm wondering if a change in blade would help my spins. Is it too soon for me to be thinking about new blades? Are the Mark IVs appropriate for my level?

I'd appreciate any thoughts!

[Casey]

The Mark IV is for someone learning crossovers, 3 turns, mohawks, lunges, waltz jumps, half jumps, etc.

So yeah, a better blade is in order.

[littlerain]

Agree with Casey in terms of what level the blade is meant for! However, that doesn't necessarily mean it will solve your issues, or that you can't learn those skills on that blade

I'm sure some of the others can weigh in, but I feel like others (or their kids) have learned quite a bit on lower level blades

Also, something like a coronation ace will have a larger toe pick which may not help with spins.

What does your coach think?

[sarahspins]

I've heard of skaters learning their axel and early doubles on the Mark IV blades, so I wouldn't just dismiss them as useless beginner blades - they are in fact a low level freeskate blade, not a blade intended only for recreational skating.

Trouble spinning may not necessarily improve with a "better" blade, but I would suggest having a coach or good sharpener take a look at your blades and make sure there wasn't damage done to the spin rocker that could be making spins more difficult (either as the product of one bad sharpening, or just something that happens over time with multiple sharpenings).  Second to that I would suggest double checking the fit of the skates - skates that are too long for your foot place the spin rocker too far forward and can make spinning well nearly impossible (as well as making some turns and jumps more difficult - but the effects are different for everyone).

[ChristyRN]

I  Second to that I would suggest double checking the fit of the skates - skates that are too long for your foot place the spin rocker too far forward and can make spinning well nearly impossible (as well as making some turns and jumps more difficult - but the effects are different for everyone).

Spinning is danged near impossible in too long boots. And when you finally get them fitted, you have to unlearn all the bad habits you learned.

[Jamie]

Thanks for the input everybody!

I went to a well respected fitter in my area so I really don't think fit's the problem. I don't have any extra toe space as far as I can tell.

I think I'm probably just frustrated and looking for a reason why my spins aren't working when all I really need to do is keep practicing. I'm going to talk to my coach (I don't have a private until Friday), but I suspect she'll say that my blades are fine and my spins are fine too for how long I've been back on the ice, haha. I definitely haven't communicated my frustrations all that much, so hopefully she'll have some input once I do.

[Query]

First, it sounds like you are a better spinner than me, and I don't think I've ever had Mark IV's, so take this with a grain of salt. But spinning can be hard to learn late in life, even if you done it before.

If you practice once or twice / week or more, I think June -> December is more than long enough to get used to your skates and blades.

Fitters are told to select the blade length and mount position by the boot outsole length and position, but there is usually no reason why that should happen to be best for you, and make no sense whatsoever. But the the overall length of the boot is completely irrelevant, because the front of the boot does not touch the ice. A really, really long boot would be a problem in the sense you couldn't bring your feet close together (though it would still look like you could), but I think you would know if that was an issue.

Even a good fitter can guess wrong for your particular body. You need a boot that hugs your heel, has the bend in the foot bed where the ball of your foot is, with an amount of bend that is both comfortable and lets you feel in control of what your skate is doing. As much as possible, the boot should be snugly comfortable all over.

As far as blade shape and length, where the blade sweet spot is relative to the ball of your foot matters, and how easy it is to reach your toe pick. If the sweet spot is just a little bit forwards of the ball of your foot (where it bends), which makes it easy for you to control motions back and forth across the sweet spot, and the toe pick feels like it is where you want it to be, then the blade is right for your spins. And the amount of heel should feel comfortable and natural. Those things you can check. But you have to be able to feel where your sweet spot is to take full advantage of it - so if the other things check out, ask your sharpener to work on that. The blade length therefore the position of the back of the blade matters if you lose balance, or if you tend to accidentally cross step one blade on the other - but that's not a spin thing.

A good sharpener can emphasize the sweet spot (make it a sharper transition or make it change directions a little), to make it easier for you to find. He/she can also move the entire blade forward and back to play with the toe pick position. If spins are all you are worried about, you may not need to change blades.

Of course, the Mark IV will wear out faster than higher level blades, because the steel isn't as durable. But that's in the future.

[Casey]

While an expert sharpener might be able to do a lot to change blade profile, that's definitely not the norm nor easy to find.  It also may not worth the investment, or risk, versus just buying better blades.  The profile is what matters most, but an expert sharpener can't just magically make a high-end blade out of cheap blades, or nobody would bother buying the much more costly blades.  The profile is also not the only aspect, as competitor blades that copy the exact profile of high-end Wilson blades do not feel the same as the original, at least according to anybody who's tried both.

If you have access to an expert sharpener, and the cost of this will be significantly lower than buying new blades, and don't mind taking a lot of risk with experimentation (you may end up having to buy new blades regardless if it doesn't go well), then perhaps it's a viable option to consider, but I doubt that's the case for most.

Sometimes you can do a lot more than blades are intended to handle with appropriate skill, but a good blade makes everything easier.