Exercises to check blade alignment on-ice?

[jjane45]

Dear all,

I am definitely not attempting to take over the pro shop's job checking the blades off-ice.

But from what I understand, most fitters have very limited means on checking how the blade alignment fits the skater in actual skating (unless the pro shop is located inside the rink). They ask you to stand with feet shoulder width apart, observe you walking back and forth, and that's pretty much it. Actual skating is a whole other story. Add that everyone's technique is different, there is a lot of variables in mounting different blades to different boots.

Are there any specific on-ice maneuvers that help isolating problems in blade alignment? I know there are many knowledgeable members who adjust the blades themselves. How do you determine which symptoms correspond to which problems? Or even identifying the symptoms?

Please correct me if I am wrong as I can't find the original post. I roughly remember reading a post by Jazzpants that says glide forward on one foot, shoulders and hips square, the skating foot should not changes easily to inside edge if the blades are aligned right... What if you have to lean sideways to achive gliding on the flat?

I am guessing to trace hockey cirles on one foot might also help? Maybe I could tape myself doing certain moves and try to get my group lesson instructor to quickly review it...

My problem is I have very minimal body awareness and could only say "edges were off" but generally not able to describe the proble m. When I last changed skates it took weeks for me to figure out that I could not hold an outside edge, and the solution was inserting some shim between blades and boots.

Suggestions and advices are greatly appreciated! :worthy

[katz in boots]

Not an expert, but have done this a few times, so here are some things I've found help.
It really helps to have an experienced person to watch you.
Firstly, 2 foot glides in a straight line.  Check your tracing, are both showing equal double tracings?  Can the person helping you see any fall-in/out?
One foot glides: again, can you do them in a straight line with double tracing? Is there obvious fall-in/out?
Now edges, are there still double tracings, cos there shouldn't be. Are you fighting the blade?  Do you feel you're over the blade or falling in/out?
Snow kicked up when doing edges often means an alignment problem.

Also, try doing the 1ft straight glides on the back of the blade then nearer the front.  Sometimes a misalignment at the heel can show up only when you put your weight further back on the blade.  

[AgnesNitt]

What you described (gliding on one foot, hips and shoulders square, have someone watch, check tracing etc) is exactly how my skate tech checks my blade alignment (and he does Evan Lysacek's skates, so he oughta know).  Since I have a defect in both legs this usually takes about 4 adjustments to get it right for me. He's very patient. Since he does minor adjustments rinkside while I'm still wearing my boots I always feel a bit like a horse getting new shoes.

[jjane45]

Many thanks to both of you, it really helped

One foot glides: again, can you do them in a straight line with double tracing? Is there obvious fall-in/out?

Now edges, are there still double tracings, cos there shouldn't be. Are you fighting the blade?  Do you feel you're over the blade or falling in/out?
Snow kicked up when doing edges often means an alignment problem.

Also, try doing the 1ft straight glides on the back of the blade then nearer the front.  Sometimes a misalignment at the heel can show up only when you put your weight further back on the blade. 

Tracings look fine, I think.

Gliding on the straight line I was fighting with a somewhat wobbly right blade. Since the right boot is also bothering me (ball hurts), I don't know how much of it was the blade.

Forward outside edges were totally absent when I try to trace hockey circles. Inside edges were smooth and easy while I had to lean much more into the circle to glide on a shaky outside edge (vs. previous skates). Definitely will need shim insertion again.

Off to the pro shop tomorrow, hope all is well

[rlichtefeld]

Another trick to try is have someone watch out for you while you glide on one foot in a straight line with your eyes closed. 

Try to glide for at least 10 feet or more.  Do you go to the left or right.  With your eyes open your body makes slight adjustments without you really realizing it.  With your eyes closed, it doesn't.

Rob

[katz in boots]

Yeah, strongly recommend an experienced skater/coach watching you do these exercises.
Even though I don't have a lot of experience, I can pick up quite a bit watching these things.
A good coach is likely to see more.

[jjane45]

Thank you so much everyone!
I will try to ask someone with good eyes to take a look

[Query]

If you have a private coach, be sure to ask him/her. He/she is probably trained to help. Some expert pro shops also contain well trained people, who will probably make the adjustment on new skates for free - but it's hard if the pro shop isn't in a rink facility, where they can see you skate.

But, as near as I can tell, it is mostly just feel. If it feels right, i.e., you feel like you are skating straight forward when your are, and you don't feel like you are using muscles asymmetrically, it is right.

If one blade is wobbly, it may not be tight, and may need to be tightened.

If outside edges are harder than inside, the problem probably isn't alignment - it is left-right offset (or more or less equivalently, the height of your insole on the inside or outside of the foot, which you can adjust by applying athletic tape strips underneath).

I think shims are only needed if the blade isn't vertical when you one-foot glide straight - and are to prevent skidding sideways. You have to be careful doing your own shims, because if they tend to twist or warp the blade, that is a very bad thing.

If you just bought these, from an expert pro shop, the shop should make all the adjustments - if you make your own, they may refuse to take responsibility for the skates.

[jjane45]

Thank you Query! I agree with "feeling right". Was just afraid that maybe I'm compensating for something that I should'nt have been.

I am not touching the blades myself, DIY is never my specialty (sigh). I previously needed shim insertion for pronation, but looks like I am fine with the current pair. (or maybe not, will see~ the tape under insole tip is great!)

[Isk8NYC]

Another trick to try is have someone watch out for you while you glide on one foot in a straight line with your eyes closed. 

Try to glide for at least 10 feet or more.  Do you go to the left or right.  With your eyes open your body makes slight adjustments without you really realizing it.  With your eyes closed, it doesn't.

This works really well - thanks for the tip.  I could sort of feel that I was off the line, but when I opened my eyes, I was shocked at how much off the line I was.  I changed the heel of my left blade and it's better, but still not great.  Grrrr....

[fsk8r]

This works really well - thanks for the tip.  I could sort of feel that I was off the line, but when I opened my eyes, I was shocked at how much off the line I was.  I changed the heel of my left blade and it's better, but still not great.  Grrrr....

Think I'll be trying this tip as well. I'm still not convinced my blades are completely right on my new boots, and if this is an easy test then I'm all for trying it.

[Isk8NYC]

Well, it's good for realizing that something's wrong.  I don't know how to diagnose it or understand which way to move the blade or change the insole.  That's definitely lacking.

For example: I know my weight is on the big-toe side (inside) of the ball on my left foot.  I'm curving to the inside as well when I use the closed-eye test.  But, what to do about it?  Do I move the blade more inside, do I add a cushion under the big-toe side to angle the weight to the outside? 

Recognizing there's a problem is only the starting point.  Sigh

[Query]

By the way, I am not an expert skater. I am just saying what makes sense intuitively, and sometimes base stuff on basic physics, and on my own mistakes. A good coach is your best guide, if they have a good understanding of how this stuff works. Do you have a private coach?

Do I move the blade more inside, do I add a cushion under the big-toe side to angle the weight to the outside?

If the weight is on the inside at the ball, the insole is probably too thick there, or, more or less equivalently, too thin on the outside, or, more or less equivalently, the blade is mounted too far to the outside up front. For small changes, adjusting any of these things works. Boot fitters usually just adjust blade position and alignment, because it is easy - and if they don't have to go so far it makes your feet sore, it may be good enough.

Don't squeeze your foot so much anywhere you lose good circulation and sensation. If you add too much tape anywhere, and makes anywhere on your foot dangerously tight, it would be better to sand down the insole there than to add tape on the opposite side. And don't let the front of your toes touch anything, and the sides of the toes should touch little, or not at all.

And remember - if a pain, sore, blister, corn or callous appears anywhere, something is probably wrong.

The blade be straight up and down when you do alignment tests. If it is leaned, you will tend to curve even if the weight and alignment are right. Sometimes it is hard to feel that, and it helps to have someone (like your coach) watch you. Creating the proper blade angle is where shims come in.

Or it might be psychological. Maybe you feel a bit insecure with your eyes closed, like a beginning skater, and are afraid to place your weight on the outside of the foot, because you might fall.

Maybe alignment is a compromise. Books say there is a "fundamental longitudinal arch" (one of the 4 or 5 supportive arches on the bottom of each foot, depending on which book you read) that is capable of supporting your entire weight. If you walked along a narrow beam, you would probably roll your feet's weight along those lines. It makes sense to support the foot with the blade along that line. But it also makes sense to place the blade in such a location and orientation that you naturally tend to skate in the direction you intuitively feel you are, when you skate straight forwards or backwards. You have psychologically adapted what you feel to be the right direction to move over your lifetime while walking and running, and you don't want to try to fight that intuition too much.

If you adjust your blade position yourself, press hard into the bottom of the boot with the screwdriver, and use a screwdriver that fits. Don't tighten too much or too little. If you make mistakes, the screw strips its hole, or you strip the head of the screw. Dealing with either takes time and effort. If you have no mechanical intuition, pro shop experts, or coaches, are wonderful.

If you don't have a coach that could do the job, maybe you could have someone video tape you while you skate and try the suggested tests, and bring it back to the pro shop?