Lady of leisure

[icedancer]

In solo dance the man is just expected to do the man's steps.  I have seen in competition where the man did one pattern of the man's steps and one pattern of the lady's steps - just to show they could do it - I think one of the women in that competition did that also.  I think it was the Westminster Waltz.

[riley876]

That's how it is in roller dance, I mistakenly assumed ice dance was the same.  Sorry, my bad.

From the 2016 FIRS Artistic Rule Book:

9.01.01 For Compulsory Dances lady's steps will be used.

[Bunny Hop]

I actually cannot think of any pattern dances where the man has a twizzle.

I think the man does twizzles in the Finnstep. Your coach will know.

[Query]

It never occurred to me that people who design dance patterns would deliberately take it easy on the guys... Though I was taught that the guy's main role, as in any couple dance, is to make the lady look good.

I don't get "solo dance". A contradiction in terms, like a romance of one. What distinguishes any good couple dance is relationship and unison.

[riley876]

I don't get "solo dance". A contradiction in terms, like a romance of one. What distinguishes any good couple dance is relationship and unison.

I've heard it said that: "Dance is a vertical expression of a horizontal desire"     "Solo Tango" is perhaps the epitome of that.   A bit like fishing without the fish   Sure you can do it, but it's missing something fundamental to the whole enterprise.

Having said all that sometimes you don't want to catch anything, it just feels good to move to music.   I used to do (partnered) swing dancing for a few years, and in the end I gave it up primarily because I couldn't face partner dancing anymore.   It felt like I was advertising something I wasn't selling...   I still love dancing in private though, just because it feels good.

My skating IS a romance of two however.   i.e. Between me and physics.   They say you're in love when all the love songs you hear seem to be all about you.   And that's true for me.   It's just a pity that physics is just not that into me    However, I have 99 ways....

[Query]

Part of what I was trying to say is that, for the most part, none of the moves in the pattern dances are individually all that difficult - men's or lady's parts. That's not the point.

Sure, getting a consistent and  correct ice tracing is hard. Good style is hard.

But the really hard part has always been moving with someone. When someone does a blind turn into closed position, and the partner is right there where they have to be at precisely the right time for the joining to be perfect, that shows real mastery. When your feet step over each other in just the right positions, and no one trips or stumbles over the other, or two people move at exactly the same time, in matched position and style, even that shows some mastery.

Dance isn't difficult moves or a "romance" with physics. It's togetherness.

[lutefisk]

I don't get "solo dance". A contradiction in terms, like a romance of one. What distinguishes any good couple dance is relationship and unison.
[/quote]

There are forms of off-ice dancing that are traditionally performed as solo expressions.  Tap dancing comes to mind--done as often without a pardner as with.  Then there's saber dancing.  At the other end of the spectrum there's step dancing with large groups of people--River Dance is an example--sort of the "synchro" of dry land dance.  Why would the movements of ice dance be immune from solo interpretation?

[riley876]

Dance isn't difficult moves or a "romance" with physics. It's togetherness.

I don't think the common definition of the word "dance" excludes solo dancing.   Not many people (apart from those who wish to creatively redefine the word), would deny that this is dance:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wAwjqRAXMXQ&list=RDEpiXAg1sd28&index=2

You are right about it being about "togetherness".  i.e. Togetherness with the music

[icedancer]

I think the solo dance track in figure skating was created just to fill in the gaps in areas where there are no available partners and a way to keep people ice-dancing!

And then solo free-dance evolved from that and then there were competitions for people that excel at solo dance.

Just FYI

And as a skater who has done ice-dance most of my skating career it is important to be able to do the dances solo.  There are just not enough partners to go around.  A lot of people make the mistake of thinking that unless they have a dedicated partner there is no reason to learn dance.  Learning dance will teach you more about skating than you knew possible and there is a whole world of social dance (less and less all the time, but there are dance weekends and get-togethers around the country and the world) - out there.

It is fun and it is do-able.  Dance!

[tstop4me]

I don't think the common definition of the word "dance" excludes solo dancing.   Not many people (apart from those who wish to creatively redefine the word), would deny that this is dance:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wAwjqRAXMXQ&list=RDEpiXAg1sd28&index=2

You are right about it being about "togetherness".  i.e. Togetherness with the music

Absolutely agree.  One of my favorite TV shows is So You Think You Can Dance, which celebrates dance in all its combinations (solo, pairs, group) and forms (ballet, ballroom, tap, hip-hop, contemporary, .....).  Solo dancing is definitely not an oxymoron.

[ls99]

I don't think the common definition of the word "dance" excludes solo dancing.   Not many people (apart from those who wish to creatively redefine the word), would deny that this is dance:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wAwjqRAXMXQ&list=RDEpiXAg1sd28&index=2

You are right about it being about "togetherness".  i.e. Togetherness with the music

Thanks for linking to my very favorite dancers Ksenia and Sharon.  A pleasant find in this forum, and yes she and SHaron most cerainly are fantastic dancers.

[riley876]

Thanks for linking to my very favorite dancers Ksenia and Sharon.  A pleasant find in this forum.

I'm very fond of some Carolina Shag dancers too,  notably:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8l5pczCZw04

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2MMLaSOXzE

[dlbritton]

I'm very fond of some Carolina Shag dancers too,  notably:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8l5pczCZw04

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2MMLaSOXzE

I grew up in the mountains of North Carolina and spent every summer in my teens at Myrtle Beach but I never cared for or learned to shag. I did enjoy clogging though.

[Query]

Of course you guys left out solo burlesque as the likely historic basis to solo dance... Could one pass a pattern dressed and styled a la burlesque? 

In most solo dance, the steps are intricate and difficult, performed to a sophisticated or sultry rhythm.

But Ice Pattern Dance came out of the Ballroom tradition. You have simple turns and steps, performed in simplified rhythm - things that even I, at preliminary test level, can do, though I have trouble checking some of the turns, particularly in sequence.  Pretty much everything really fancy in Ice Pattern Dance, like Ballroom, requires a partner. So I will never will "get" solo ice dance.

[riley876]

The trouble I see with ice dance is exactly that ballroom heritage.  It does well for waltzes and marches and passably OK for foxtrots.

But the moment they tried to extend it to anything else,  e.g. tangos, "swing" dancing, quickstep, blues, anything at all latin etc (or god forbid even disco).   It starts bearing little resemblance to the actual dance and they all look like generic "ice dance" style.   It's like a ballroom dancer designed the dances exactly from a detailed book description of the dances, but having never seen them in person.   e.g. TOTALLY missing the crucial element in swing of the accented swung eighths.

I agree that there's little point in formal solo ice dance, at least in the straight jacket "dance like how we tell you to, or you don't dance at all!!!" compulsory forms.    If you're dancing solo (and we clearly differ on the oxymoronicity of that phrase), then only free dance makes any sense.   Since expression can be much freer when you don't have to stay connected/flirt with a partner.  i.e. not every expression has to be about datin'n'mating as it is in partner dance.   

[lutefisk]

Of course you guys left out solo burlesque as the likely historic basis to solo dance...

No true!  Most of the Rhythm blues music sounds like stripper music...

[FigureSpins]

ITA!  I say it every time it plays.  Sometimes (depending on who's on the ice) I even skate a little naughty when it's playing.

[icedancer]

ITA!  I say it every time it plays.  Sometimes (depending on who's on the ice) I even skate a little naughty when it's playing.

I guess that is the point!  It makes you skate sultry...

When I tested the Blues they played that - when I got off the ice one lady said to me, "I thought you were going to take off your clothes!!"  I guess I nailed it!

[ls99]

I'm very fond of some Carolina Shag dancers too,  notably:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8l5pczCZw04

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2MMLaSOXzE

You sure know how to find my favorites:)