Arch pain

[tammyk]

I've been having severe arch pain in both feet since September. I'm in Jackson Freestyles that were purchased a year ago and a very beginner skater. My coach and fitter believe it's due to severe pronating. The blades have been moved, shimmed, and I have swapped out the insole for yellow superfeet. It's been a few weeks since the most recent adjustments.  A fellow adult skater at my rink who is a physical therapist looked at the yellow superfeet and said they fit my feet correctly. Someone on here recommended that I try the black superfeet and I'm waiting for the fitter to get back to me. I was wondering if anyone else had any other suggestions before I spend more money. I've also tried tying the laces looser but I have to be careful with that because I have a narrow heel.

I don't have arch pain nor do I require inserts or orthotics in other shoes. Yesterday I could only skate for 5 minutes before taking my skates off then could only 20 more minutes. This is typical.

Any suggestions would be appreciated.

Thanks!

[DressmakingMomma]

My daughter has strong pronation on one foot and moderate on the other and had severe arch pain when skating. We tried several different insoes including superfeet which didn't work. We went to a new tech and he added cork heel wedges to roll her feet outwards. Since her arches are low, arch support pads pushed up into her feet and were uncomfortable. Instead, we bought thin foam pads meant for the ball of the foot in high heels and placed them under her insoles but on top of the cork wedges positioned so the pad started on the bottom of the skate about midway between the inside and outside and then wrapped up the side of the skate. It took some experimenting to get the right wedge hight and pad placement but it was worth the effort because the combination eliminated the pain.

You start with something like this, and then sand down the outside half to create a wedge that pushes inner part of your foot upwards and out to correct the pronation.
http://www.amazon.com/Heel-Lift-Rubber-Cork-Small/dp/B0169DP58S/ref=sr_1_9?ie=UTF8&qid=1455302124&sr=8-9&keywords=cork+heel+lift

Add this type of pad underneath of your arch, but then wrap it up the instep of your boot. You can cut and layer multiples if needed.
http://www.amazon.com/Foot-Petals-Toes-Cushions-Black-Iris-3/dp/B001OAB79I/ref=sr_1_15?ie=UTF8&qid=1455303013&sr=8-15&keywords=foot+petals

[AgnesNitt]

CORRECTION!  (Sorry, I left the link off) 

IF you go to this page, you'll see two alternate tying techniques (one for pain at the bottom and another for high arches) to try.

[sparkleskates]

I am starting to wonder if this is a common occurrence in Jacksons! I just got a pair if Premiere's (previously in a pair of  Riedell's that were too narrow) and am having the same issue. One of the other skaters at my rink told me she had a similar issue with hers.

[irenar5]

I have to be very specific about tying the laces in my custom Harlicks, otherwise I get arch pain as well.

In the holes over the instep I tie the laces semi-snugly (I am able to move them with my finger after I tied them).  The first and the second bottom hooks after the holes I tie VERY tightly and then not as tight over the last 2 top hooks.
If I overtighten the instep - severe arch pain and cramping. 

When I retie my skates during the session, I never retie them over the instep holes, I just tighten the first 2 bottom hooks.

I would definitely experiment with the lacing.  According to the lacing instructions, the laces should be tight over the instep and sole, but that has never worked for me. 

[rd350]

I have to tie my custom Harlicks the same way or I get cramping too (after more than a year with them).  If I tie it ever so slightly too much lower down - bad cramping.

[tstop4me]

I am starting to wonder if this is a common occurrence in Jacksons! I just got a pair if Premiere's (previously in a pair of  Riedell's that were too narrow) and am having the same issue. One of the other skaters at my rink told me she had a similar issue with hers.

I don't know what the current generation of Riedell's is like.  But about a year ago, I switched from an old pair of classic Riedell Royals to a Jackson Elite Suede (men's; the Jackson men's line differs from the Jackson women's line somewhat).  The Jacksons were a much better fit for me, because I have a narrower heel width relative to my toe width; and Jackson advanced boots are shaped on a split last with this combo.  There were some major differences to adjust to though.  I have fallen arches, but the Royals have pronounced arch supports built into the boots, and I always had sufficient arch support.  The Elite Suedes have no arch support built in at all.  They come with removable "Elite Matrix Footbeds".  At first glance, the "footbeds" appear to have shaped support: heel cups and arch supports.  But they are hokey:  the footbeds are formed from multiple layers of soft foam.  When you step on them, they collapse into plain-vanilla flat insoles.  I ended up adding heel wedges and arch supports to the footbeds to provide proper support and to overcome my pronation.

The Jacksons also had a much higher heel pitch than the Riedells.  This can cause more pressure along the metatarsal arches and the fronts of the longitudinal arches.

[Query]

I am starting to wonder if this is a common occurrence in Jacksons!

It's a common occurrence in all brands of skate. If they don't fit your feet right, or are not balanced to your feet.

Anytime you have a very snug shoe that forces your feet into a particular shape, and that shape exceeds the comfortable flexibility limits of your feet, or forces you to use muscles too much to maintain balance (creating muscle over-use problems), you will hurt.

It's not your foot. It's not the skate. They may both be fine. It's how they fit and work together. There is no such thing as a generic shoe, boot, insole, insert, or orthotic, that works well for everyone. There never will be.

[sparkleskates]

The Jacksons also had a much higher heel pitch than the Riedells.  This can cause more pressure along the metatarsal arches and the fronts of the longitudinal arches.

The fitter mentioned the heel pitch when we were trying to figure out what was going to work for me.  I think my issue is a combination of figuring out the new boots, after being off ice for the last 6 months rehabing a shoulder surgery.  It's taking me longer than I would like to get my groove back. Changing out the insoles seems to have resolved my issue. They were much better today.

[tstop4me]

The fitter mentioned the heel pitch when we were trying to figure out what was going to work for me.  I think my issue is a combination of figuring out the new boots, after being off ice for the last 6 months rehabing a shoulder surgery.  It's taking me longer than I would like to get my groove back. Changing out the insoles seems to have resolved my issue. They were much better today.

It took me several iterations of changing the insole configuration and changing the blade mounting configuration before I got it right.  I also ending up having to relearn my backward skating.  For reasons that I still don't understand, the higher heel pitch caused me to rise up a lot towards my toepicks when I was skating backwards (but not so much forwards).  I had to deliberately lean back strongly to counteract this tendency.  I mentioned this to a couple of skate techs at my shop (both coaches and ex-pro skaters and ex-competitive skaters), who have skated in a variety of gear.  They told me that they both had had the same experience and was normal when switching to boots with a higher heel pitch.

[Doubletoe]

I have no idea if this is part of your problem or not, but I know that I always get arch cramping when my boots are too narrow in the ball of the foot.  Are yours roomy enough across the ball and instep? 

[tammyk]

I have no idea if this is part of your problem or not, but I know that I always get arch cramping when my boots are too narrow in the ball of the foot.  Are yours roomy enough across the ball and instep?

The ball is not too narrow. For the instep, I don't think so. Is there a way to be certain of that? I've walked around the house in them for 30 minutes or so a few times trying different thing and nothing bothers me. It only hurts while skating. I do have a narrow foot. I wear a narrow in sneakers and regular boots. I'm in a 7A in the skates.
.
Thanks everyone for all of the suggestions. I've tried all of them. I think I need to play with the arch support some more. When I added a different one than I previously tried I made it 10 minutes instead of 5. I think it might have been too much with the superfeet.

[DressmakingMomma]

You can get arch pain from having too much room as well as not enough up in the toe box. You mention that you have to tie tight enough to feel supported so could it be that your foot isn't as stable as it should be in the boot? You could try tracing the front, ball part of your insole onto a piece of craft foam and tuck that up under your insole to take up a bit of room. This will also reduce the heel pitch slightly - we did this temporarily when switching to the Edea boot so my DD could gradually get used to the heel pitch.

[rd350]

I wonder if you are gripping your toes when you skate, since they don't bother you walking around the house.  That could cause arch pain as well.  Something to pay attention to when you're on the ice and see.

[TreSk8sAZ]

Way late to the discussion, but my arch pain in my last boots was caused by my boots being too long. They were also too wide, but my fitter said it was the too long part that was causing the arch cramps.

[Query]

Way late to the discussion, but my arch pain in my last boots was caused by my boots being too long.

Let's see i I understand the basic idea. Because your boots were too long, the part of the insole where it bends upwards was too far forwards on your feet. As near as I can figure out, your foot is able to sustain an upwards bend near the ball of the foot (either because of inherent structure, or because we constantly wear shoes that have such a bend), but it can't easily sustain such a bend elsewhere. Having the bend in the wrong place caused some of your muscles, tendons, or other connective tissue to be continually subject to excessive stretching, or excessive compression.

If I'm right, it still comes down to the basic concept that if the shape of the boot doesn't match the shape of your foot, that gets you into trouble - not the excess length itself.

I'm using a pair of boots that are 1 to 1.5 sizes to large, without such problems. But I created foam insoles that filled space in such as way as to make them fit my feet perfectly, corrected for all balance issues, heat molded them, and I wear thick squishy socks. I love the result - though they are a bit heavy, which makes it harder to jump, and harder to control spins.

If your boots were both too long and too wide, there was space for you to have done the same thing. But hopefully you are happy with whatever you did instead. If a really good job is done on fitting and adjusting good custom boots, they can accomplish the same things - and weigh less.

[tammyk]

I made my own arch support from 2 layers of craft foam and taped it to the bottom of the Jackson insoles. It worked! I was able to skate an entire hour without getting off of the ice. The left foot never hurt. The right did a little at one point but went away. I am so relieved!

Thanks for all of the suggestions!

[skategeek]

Yay!

[Query]

Congratulations! Happy skating!

If craft foam gradually compresses (I don't know that it will) and become less useful, you may want to re-adjust upon occasion.

Isn't it cool when simple things you can do yourself work?