Invalid elements at competitions

[irenar5]

I have seen a few "invalid" remarks in this season's scores.  For example-Mirai Nagasu  at the Int'l FS Classic- had a triple flip/single toe combo instead of a planned triple/double and the single toe was "invalid". Courtney Hicks had a single axel also called "invalid", where a double was planned.  0 points are given to an invalid element.   Is this a new thing in IJS?

Can someone clarify, please?

[TreSk8sAZ]

I'm guessing it's because it's the short program and they did not complete the requirement. For example, in Sr. ladies the combo must be a double-triple, triple-double or triple triple. Mirai's single toe did not meet the requirement. Similarly, there must be a double or triple axel. This penalizes those that do not do the required elements rather than just taking the lesser single axel score.

I'd have to check the tech notifications, but I'm pretty sure that's why.

[nicklaszlo]

There is a new rule this year that single jumps have no value for senior skaters.

[techskater]

Az is correct.  In sp, if it doesn't meet requirements, it is invalid and receives no value

[irenar5]

In sp, if it doesn't meet requirements, it is invalid and receives no value

Has it always been like this or is it a new thing?

[fsk8r]

Has it always been like this or is it a new thing?

They used to get the Technical call but the judges had to give -3 GOE regardless of the quality as it wasn't a required element. I think this is the first season where they blank out all score as there are some (lower level) skaters trying to compete at Junior and Senior who don't have the minimum required elements. It's a good way to encourage these skaters to keep working towards the harder elements.

[techskater]

Has it always been like this or is it a new thing?

It's in this year's updates along with anything > 1.5 revolutions in Seniors receiving no value

[irenar5]

Thanks for the clarification!

[nicklaszlo]

techskater means "less than 1.5." Just in case that is not apparent.

[Doubletoe]

It's in this year's updates along with anything > 1.5 revolutions in Seniors receiving no value

You mean < 1.5 revolutions, right?  Is that just for short program or for freeskate, too?  So if a skater does a triple jump-half loop-triple jump combo, the half loop (which counts as a single loop) will no longer be worth 0.5 points and they only get the value of the first and last jump?

[techskater]

Invalid is a sp thing, but anything less than a single Axel it's worth no value in the fs.

[Doubletoe]

I get the rule about the required number of revolutions in the short program but can't find the new rule about no single jumps in the freeskate.  In here, it still says a half loop done between two listed jumps gets the value of a single loop:  http://static.isu.org/media/166006/tphandbook_singleskating_2014-15.pdf

[techskater]

It's not up to date.  Go look at SLC protocols.

[blue111moon]

USFigure Skating's Tech Panel rules state that jump elements not required in the SP receive no value.  For Novice, Junior and Senior SP the jump requirements specify double and triple jumps, either solo or in combination.  Therefore, single jumps do not count because they're not part of the requirements for the level.

[Doubletoe]

It's not up to date.  Go look at SLC protocols.

In the SLC protocols, senior level skaters still got credit for single jumps in the freeskate.  Polina Edmunds did 3F+1Lo+3S and got 10.00 (= 5.3 + 0.5 + 4.2).  Another Senior lady did 3T + 1T + 2Lo and got 6.3 before GOE (= 4.1 + 0.4 + 1.8 ).

[sarahspins]

In the SLC protocols, senior level skaters still got credit for single jumps in the freeskate.  Polina Edmunds did 3F+1Lo+3S and got 10.00 (= 5.3 + 0.5 + 4.2).  Another Senior lady did 3T + 1T + 2Lo and got 6.3 before GOE (= 4.1 + 0.4 + 1..

I wonder if the difference there is that jump is part of a sequence and not a combination?

[Doubletoe]

I wonder if the difference there is that jump is part of a sequence and not a combination?

No, because that is now considered a combination.  Also, one of the other senior ladies got full points for 3T+1T+2Lo (see addition to my post above).