Taking ISI Tests and Competing

[Nate]

I really like that the ISI sort or retains a lot of the old elements that USFS sort of abandoned, as well as some things that you used to see a lot (like jumps in both directions) that aren't so common in the USFS system (or not tested at all, really).

But I have never been able to find a decent ISI rink.  I joined it for a while and the woman kept cancelling on me to move past the third level to the point where I'd have needed to do like 5 tests to catch up to my skill level, and she wasn't up to that.

Now that I've moved though...  This thread has really sparked that interest again...  Can possibly give me more opportunities to compete, as well (doing both ISI and USFS).

[sarahspins]

From what I understand about ISI.... if you have a few tests to catch up on, you only need a program with music for the highest level tested, so you could test all of the required freestyle elements for all the tests you need, and then only do a program with music for the highest level (I only remember that because it's how I did it). 

You can also test the new open levels which are a lot more flexible in terms of required/allowed elements.

[Nate]

I'm definitely going to look into that, then!

[jjane45]

so you could test all of the required freestyle elements for all the tests you need, and then only do a program with music for the highest level (I only remember that because it's how I did it).  

Ditto.

[FigureSpins]

Unless they changed the multi-test rule last year, the ISI requires the skater to test every Freestyle level with a program.  The highest test level being attempted should be a finished program.  The prerequisite level programs can be very simple, even without music, but there's a mandatory minimal score in one category of judging - I don't remember which one; maybe musicality or performance?  A skater with weak elements might not pass if they need that performance score to put them over the top.  If you don't pass the lower-level tests, you can't take the higher-level one.

A lot of rinks and coaches ignore that rule when a skater needs to take multiple tests in one session.  I've been to ISI seminars that emphasize and explain it clearly, yet it obviously still continues to be an issue. The ISI has no way of checking to see if the judge/coach actually reviewed both elements and program.

A lot of rinks have switched over to USFSA Basic Skills programs from ISI, so it's usually easier to find a private coach willing to do the testing.  Since the ISI has element restrictions on all levels, even in the "metal" categories, make sure the coach who choreographs your competition program has experience.  There are scoring implications on doing elements from higher levels.  Oh, and get your own, current, copy of the rulebook, just to make sure you understand the rules as well.

[jjane45]

Thank you for sharing and sorry for giving incorrect info. My ISI testing session was indeed very informal.

In ISI, can coaches test their own private students?

[Skittl1321]

In ISI, can coaches test their own private students?

It is discouraged, however, if there is no one else to do it, ISI allows the tests to be registered.  (My tests were all done by my coach- the only ISI coach at our rink, or surrounding rinks). 

[sampaguita]

Was thinking of creating a separate thread earlier, but I think it would be relevant here as well. Slightly off-topic, but anyway:

I saw another skater in my rink practicing all her outside and inside 3-turns, which were not up to par with the ISI handbook requirements. I thought that she was in Gamma/Delta level, but she later told me that she had just *passed* FS 1. I asked her how the tests were, and she said that at the end of here FS 1 lessons (here we buy them by a batch of 6 sessions), her coach just asked her to do certain moves, and then told her she could move up.

I understand the philosophy here: don't keep the skater stuck in the lower levels, but just improve on those moves as the skater moves up. I think that ISI has the same philosophy (why put backward edges in FS 1?). Not exactly wrong, although it's not my style -- I cannot imagine jumping or spinning without having good edges and turns.

So those who are familiar with the ISI judging system: how strict is ISI judging supposed to be, really, at least for the Alpha-FS2 levels?

[Skittl1321]

Moving up a level in classes does not necessarily equate to the test being registered with ISI and being able to compete in that level.

When we had an ISI rink (we no longer do, hence all my freeskate tests done by my coach) it was not uncommon for a skater to be told they did not pass the Gamma test, but to sign up for Delta classes and work on the problem move.  The skate would not be able to even compete Gamma yet (because you compete in the last level passed)- but is taking Delta classes.

That said, there are always programs that pass people who shouldn't be passed- it is called social promotion, they just move up with the class or the end of the session.  It is in your best interest to not worry about these people- unlike sandbaggers, they are only hurting themselves. 

A properly run ISI test at the basic skills level is, IMO, harder than a USFS LTS one. The "trouble" moves can keep skaters in the levels for a very long time.  I would say for the low freestyle levels, the tests are more lax than a USFSA official test- because there isn't necessarily a "test session".

[jjane45]

I cannot imagine jumping or spinning without having good edges and turns.

So those who are familiar with the ISI judging system: how strict is ISI judging supposed to be, really, at least for the Alpha-FS2 levels?

I have seen skaters having huge problems with salchow because they cannot check and hold the second half of the three turn to save their lives. When I suggest working on the three turns in isolation I get a weird look, like that's back in gamma and I'm freestyle 2!!! Oh well.

Pity passes are not uncommon in classes, standard varies from rink to rink. A very common trouble element is the sit spin in FS4, but lots of kids who pass with weak positions later get it anyways, especially if they have private lessons in the side.

xanboni has quite a few posts on the problems of moving up group skaters prematurely. On the other hand, programs want to keep skaters interested and motivated, so there is a tricky balance...

[Skate@Delaware]

My coach tested me (way back when I was ISI) as she was the only one at the rink ISI-rated.  I skated each program to music (just a variation of my competition program).  For actual competitions, I know the judges I had were looking very closely at the "dance pattern" that was mandatory.  Big emphasis on footwork, less so on jumps & spins.  Contrast with USFS 

[luckykid]

A properly run ISI test at the basic skills level is, IMO, harder than a USFS LTS one. The "trouble" moves can keep skaters in the levels for a very long time.  I would say for the low freestyle levels, the tests are more lax than a USFSA official test- because there isn't necessarily a "test session".

I was held back in FS1 for a really long time due to my unsatisfactory backward edges.

[Skittl1321]

I was held back in FS1 for a really long time due to my unsatisfactory backward edges.

In either system, if you can't do the elements, you aren't going to pass the test.

However, I'm going to stick to my comment that ISI is more lax.  There is generally no formal test, just an informal one where you do the elements and your program for the skate director, or your own coach.  There are no special judges brought in.  These local judges know what you are capable of, and sometimes will give skaters who have mastery of the elements a bit of leeway if they get nervous for the test.  A USFS test session things are very formal. 

[techskater]

Low level tests can be a lot less formal where you bring in one judge on a FS session for pre-pre or pre-bronze

[jjane45]

You know I've been thinking about getting back into ISI.  I skated ISI when I was a kid, I can't remember how far I tested up to though lol.  My coach refuses to do anything ISI related, however the rink that I teach LTS is ISI only.  I really like the Open Events they have advertised, and I know the competitions/testing is much more inexpensive than USFS

Carrying on the conversation in this thread... If you are interested in competing ISI (which is indeed considerably cheaper and allegedly more fun), sign up for membership and get tested (did not cost anything for me).

I am not sure if you even need a private coach's permission / recommendation to test the lower levels, it's rather casual. Will your coach disown you when she finds out? 

[sarahspins]

Low level tests can be a lot less formal where you bring in one judge on a FS session for pre-pre or pre-bronze

This is true, however those levels are still a very useful introduction to the test session procedures.

[PinkLaces]

My rink is pretty informal about testing ISI Tot-Delta. They punch the card for each skill.  When all the skills are punched, you pass.

Once you get to FS1 or any of the metals (Bronze, Silver, etc). You have to go through a 3 judge panel consisting of 3 coaches that are not your own. They are pretty tough.  If you don't get all elements with at least a 5, they will not let you skate the program.  I've also seen them not allow reskates on elements after the program.  I don't remember what the rule is for ISI but I thought you could reskate 1 or 2 elements depending on the level.  I heard on the last test session none of the kids passed - these were FS 4, 5, & 6 tests.