Switching from USFSA LtS to ISI LtS

[momomizu]

As I had said in anohter thread, I didnt want to get on the ice anymore. At that time I was having a very bad day and my skating session went horrible as a result. Anyway, my question is:
I passed USFSA Basic 6 last year and have been working on the skills still. I will be going to an ISI rink now and I have no clue as to which level I should be signing up for.  

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This is ISIs levels of which I know moves from both:

Gamma (Level 5) (Ages 4 & up)

Backward outside/inside edges on circle
Backward stopping
Forward outside edges (on line)
Forward outside 3-turn
Forward inside pivots (not for hockey skates)
2-foot spin to 1-foot spin (3 revolutions with foot up)
Side toe-hop (not for hockey skates)

Delta (Level 6) (Ages 4 & up)

Backward to forward 2-foot turn on circle
Forward inside edges (on line)
Forward inside 3-turn
T-stops
Bunny hop
Spiral, lunge or shoot the duck
Ballet Jump
Review of forward and backward crossovers

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The elements I underlined and italicized are the two I haven't ever learned. Although, I'm not sure what an inside pivot is and we for sure didnt learn ballet jump.

Reason im switching is the ISI rink is closer and cheaper and I can get there by bus.

[AgnesNitt]

It's probably not worth worrying about. I switched from ISI to Basic Skills, and the pivot takes about 5 minutes to learn. I can't say about the ballet jump as I do dance.

This rink has a chart for ISI vs Basic Skills. I think it's wrong in a couple of ways but it looks really official.

http://assets.ngin.com/attachments/document/0020/4716/ISI_USFS_equvalent.pdf

[sarahspins]

Talk to the skating school director - usually they will either do a short evaluation (maybe just talking, maybe on ice) to figure out where you should be, or they will tell you to start off at a given level, and if you find it easy, just move you up to the next one, and likewise if you find it difficult, maybe move you down a level.  I wouldn't worry too much about it, honestly

The inside pivots show up in level 7 in basic skills, but personally I wouldn't worry much about them as you migrate over to ISI... the pivots aren't tested in ISI until FS1, and the ballet jump isn't tested at all in ISI (and I am not sure I ever learned to do one, and I tested through FS5 in ISI).  Depending on your skate school, you may be formally tested when you move up a class level, or you might not be - we were never tested at my ISI rink unless we asked to be, partially because there is a fee associated with testing that was not built into the class structure.

Truthfully if you've mastered everything else, you're probably fine to start off in freestyle 1

[FigureSpins]

I don't know where the OP found that list of elements, but it doesn't match the ISI Curriculum:
http://www.skateisi.com/site/Sub.Cfm?Content=Testing_Requirements#7

Here's the current USFSA BSS Curriculum:
http://www.usfsa.org/content/BS-overview.pdf

IMO, USFSA BSS Basic 6 would be the equivalent of ISI Delta.  If you haven't skated in a while, register for the class and see if they move you up - you might need to review some of the skills to make them stronger.  I say taht because you sound discouraged about your skating.  Working on three turns and edges will help you regain your skills from last year.

If you choose to register for ISI Freestyle 1, you might stay at that level for more than one session if you have to regain basics.

...the ballet jump isn't tested at all in ISI (and I am not sure I ever learned to do one, and I tested through FS5 in ISI). 

The Forward Inside Pivots are in ISI Freestyle 1 and you have to perform them in both directions.  They're pretty easy to learn, as long as you keep your weight on the pivoting foot and keep the free leg on an inside edge BEHIND the heel of the pivoting foot.   (Think of the two blades making a "T")

The Ballet Jump is in ISI Freestyle 2.  It's a simple hop jump with a toe assist.

[momomizu]

I got the elements from the rink's website.  
http://www.montgomeryparks.org/enterprise/ice/wheaton/documents/wheatonskillssheet_001.pdf
I do find it odd because my USFSA rink followed the USFSA curriculum exactly. I'm a bit wary then if the ISI rink isn't following the correct ISI curriculum....
But wait, I noticed Gamma(on the ISI site) has Mohawks. I don't even know what they are let alone how to do them. o_0  I checked over my rink's list and they don't do Mohawks until 'Intro to Freestyle'. I guess I really need to talk to the skating director then to get all this clarified.

[FigureSpins]

It looks like a hybrid of ISI and USFSA.  Talk to the director before you sign up for anything.

ISI Gamma does include mohawks in both directions.  It's in the BSS Basic 7 test level, so you wouldn't have learned them yet.
The Wheaton rink isn't teaching them until their "Intro to Freestyle" level.  Very unusual since hockey players need mohawks, too.

[momomizu]

Wheaton has a separate hockey program: http://www.montgomeryparks.org/enterprise/ice/wheaton/documents/wheatonhockeyprograms_002.pdf

skating classes start next week, so im hoping to get a chance to talk to the director before then

[LilJen]

The Forward Inside Pivots are in ISI Freestyle 1 and you have to perform them in both directions.  They're pretty easy to learn, as long as you keep your weight on the pivoting foot and keep the free leg on an inside edge BEHIND the heel of the pivoting foot.   (Think of the two blades making a "T")

The Ballet Jump is in ISI Freestyle 2.  It's a simple hop jump with a toe assist.

Don't you be dissin' the difficulty of the inside pivot. That one took me FOREVER for some reason!! And the ballet jump is another of those terrible forward-landing toe hoppy bits, with great potential for belly flops.

Good luck, momomizu! And have fun!

[Skittl1321]

I excused myself from a class in tears on first encounter with a ballet jump.  I now use it in both my programs -

As for inside pivot, that one is easy peasy for me, but I can't do an outside to save my life.  I know others with the opposite problem, so I think it just varies.

[hopskipjump]

We moved from a ISI rink to an ISI rink that was quasi ISI once past delta the classes all had different names and didn't match what dd did at her other rink.  I called the rink manager and he took 10 minutes on the ice to see what dd was doing and placed her for me.  It was free and she was appropriately placed.  So in your shoes, i would just call.

[momomizu]

I emailed a blogger who skates at the new rink and she suggested I go for Gamma. I agreed since I do need a refresher in some things, mainly 3 turns. I feel like i've taken two steps back but if it's for the well-being of my skating, well, there's not much I can do. I start Sunday. The blogger also said that it's possible they could move me up or down depending how they see fit.

[Qarol]

I learned to skate under ISI rules and tested through Freestyle 4. Of course, this was back in college.

A ballet jump done well is so pretty...

[momomizu]

So, at what level do you have to actually do testing in front of judges? or do you just continue to do the end of skating session type testing?

agreed
, i've seen some gorgeous ballet jumps

[Qarol]

So, at what level do you have to actually do testing in front of judges? or do you just continue to do the end of skating session type testing?

This was years ago, of course, but when I tested, starting at about FS 3, you needed a program. Nothing fancy, but just something to pull all the elements together. Then I tested in front of my coach. No judges. That could be different now. And I'm not sure what I would have had to do to test for FS 5. I never quite got that far. I think USFSA is a bit different, but I've never tested that route.

[blue111moon]

In USFS, you start testing in front of official judges once you're out of the Basic Skills Badge levels.  First test is Pre-Preliminary Moves.  A panel is generally three judges, but at the lowest levels you can have only one judge if the judge's ranking is high enough.

[sarahspins]

In ISI I'm not sure you ever do face a "panel" of judges, except maybe for maybe the highest FS levels?  I know when I was testing ISI, skaters only tested up through FS 6 or 7 and at that level a coach could judge the tests, and usually did so during a regular session.  At FS5 my coach had another coach test me, but it was still fairly informal.  In fact I didn't even have an official program for the test, I did sort of an interperative number.

[FigureSpins]

The test setting in ISI varies from program to program.  I've heard/seen:

. the instructor tests their own group/student in class
. a different instructor tests the group/student in class
. a separate "test date" is held and students skate for one or more judges
. testing at an ISI event, like a competition

I can't find my rulebook right now, which is annoying me to no end.  If you're going totest or compete in ISI, you have to get a rulebook.
Wait for the 2012 edition to come out in December.  It's hard-copy only, but it's filled with valuable information that any ISI skater or coach needs to know.  Afaik, they don't offer an electronic version.

This page explains one particular program's testing guidelines: http://hutchfigureskating.org/board-members/hfsa-testing-policy/

I think that the Pre-Alpha - Delta levels are skills-only.  Freestyle 1-6 require a skills demonstration plus a program.  I never heard of this before last year, but apparently many programs will not let the skater perform the program portion if they don't first pass the skills portion.

If you're testing more than one freestyle test at the same session, you can do a bare-bones minimum program for the lower-level test(s) and accept a low score in one of the judging categories.  The highest-level freestyle test requires a full-blown program.

For Freestyle 7 and above, the skater must test before an approved, gold-level ISI judging panel at a special session, event or one of the ISI's National events.  They used to allow a video to be submitted to HQ for Freestyle 7&8, but I don't know if that's still an option.

[momomizu]

wow, so i can expect to just do end of session style testing then? i don't think i'll get to compete, i have no grace, rhythm whatsoever 

[FigureSpins]

You'll have to check with the rink/program you're attending, but I think they probably test during the last week of classes.

In Learn to Skate testing, there's usually a difference between end-of-session testing, which is used to determine the next-session group class rosters, and tests that are being registered with ISI HQ or used for Basic Skills competitions. 

[jjane45]

If you're testing more than one freestyle test at the same session, you can do a bare-bones minimum program for the lower-level test(s) and accept a low score in one of the judging categories.  The highest-level freestyle test requires a full-blown program.

Apparently my rink requires a gold tested judge for official ISI tests, and recently only the skating director can administer them due to some events.

If more than one freestyle levels are tested at the same time at my rink, it seems a simple program is only required for the highest level tested. But I don't know anything definite (yet).