Landing position

skatingmum2 · August 31, 2011, 04:59:18 PM

I'm still confused about the whole knee bend thing. DD - doing doubles (and double doubles). Part of a group training program plus individual lessons. The one coach says she has a lovely soft knee on landing but others say her knee bend is way too deep.

Can it be too deep?

This is a 12 year old switched 9 months ago from mainly dance to mainly free skating (growth spurt put end to partnership). She has deeper knee bend than most free skaters. I've noticed if she is doing a double-double her knee bend is slightly less after the first jump but at times its almost 90 degrees.

How does a kid correct this?Would photo's be helpful?

Sk8tmum · August 31, 2011, 05:36:40 PM

This is why having multiple coaches teaching jumps causes problems. One coach likes one landing position and another a different one; one teachs one type of entry, a different one a different type of entry ... unless the coaches have a similar style, it can be very difficult for a kid to work with.

I would discuss the mixed messages with her base freeskate coach and then let the base freeskate coach fix it or not based on the way the base freeskate coach wants the jumps executed. Generally, coaches value a soft, deep knee bend, and will point out the depth of knee on ice-dancers when they are trying to get their freeskaters to use their knees well and "skate into" rather than "skate on" the ice.

My kid used to get chased around the ice practicing depth of knee and edges, and is wayyyy underbooted (by most peoples standards) so that we have a deep, soft knee on landing; as a result, there is less wear and tear on the knee and hip and back, and landings can be "held" even when a bit wonky.

skatingmum2 · September 01, 2011, 05:24:55 PM

Will ask for more details and explanation. I know we've been told she looks like an ice-dancer who jumps and think that people have differing opinions about whether it is a problem or not.

As she's only seriously tackled the area of jumping & free skating since December 2010 this is something which is rapidly improving BUT she is still on a steep learning curve. (An ice dance judge recently chatted to me and said she had every feature they looked for in an ice dancer and found it quite sad she is "wasting" her time doing free where there is little point to trying to achieve jumps at an older age). I've probably made that sound meaner than it was when he said it...he did mean it in a nice way.

Sk8Dreams · September 01, 2011, 06:25:21 PM

Quote from: skatingmum2 on September 01, 2011, 05:24:55 PM
I know we've been told she looks like an ice-dancer who jumps and think that people have differing opinions about whether it is a problem or not.

I think it's a plus. At the PSA Conference in May, Virtue & Moir told us that freestyle skaters are now studying with dance coaches to improve their presentation marks.

sarahspins · September 01, 2011, 06:42:59 PM

Quote from: skatingmum2 on September 01, 2011, 05:24:55 PMthere is little point to trying to achieve jumps at an older age

She's 12? I don't really understand this.. if she's ENJOYING it, what is the problem exactly? I think she is far from "too old" and I can't believe a coach would say that.

As far as the knee bend, I think unless she is landing on an already very bent knee (which looks really odd if you've seen it done) then it's not a problem. Soft knees with a deep bend are not a bad thing at all

isakswings · September 01, 2011, 11:19:07 PM

Quote from: sarahspins on September 01, 2011, 06:42:59 PM
She's 12? I don't really understand this.. if she's ENJOYING it, what is the problem exactly? I think she is far from "too old" and I can't believe a coach would say that.

I agree! My daughter is 13. She's working on doubles(sal and toe). While we know she is "older" then some, she is certainly not too old to be working on jumps.

I bet the judge just misses seeing the OP's daughter in ice dance. Good for her daughter for doing all she can to learn and do something she enjoys! I am sure the ice dance experience makes her a very pretty freestyle skater too!

skatingmum2 · September 02, 2011, 06:00:32 AM

Yes - I think the judge is keen to see her dancing (and there have been a few test judges from dance tests who have written lovely comments and directly asked her why she does free skating) and that judge keeps suggesting ways we could search for partners.... but - the whole partner thing was a very hurtful experience for my daughter which is why she isn't keen to go there again. Its a potentially nasty world out there and I'm thrilled she was tough enough to cope with what that boy said to her when she grew 3 inches....(His parents were divorced and at war so no adult in charge of him that one could talk to about what he said).

I can see that she skates more upright than many people who have done free all their lives (rather than bending forwards slightly) so it does look lovely to me - but - hardly profess knowledge about any of this stuff. However I don't intend for her to become an "ice skater" - its a hobby that she loves more than anything else in the world and it doesn't matter if she is not particularly good! I could see her loving doing some shows maybe for a year before she goes to university (if she skates that long)!

fsk8r · September 02, 2011, 06:52:04 AM

Quote from: skatingmum2 on September 02, 2011, 06:00:32 AM
Yes - I think the judge is keen to see her dancing (and there have been a few test judges from dance tests who have written lovely comments and directly asked her why she does free skating) and that judge keeps suggesting ways we could search for partners.... but - the whole partner thing was a very hurtful experience for my daughter which is why she isn't keen to go there again. Its a potentially nasty world out there and I'm thrilled she was tough enough to cope with what that boy said to her when she grew 3 inches....(His parents were divorced and at war so no adult in charge of him that one could talk to about what he said).

I can see that she skates more upright than many people who have done free all their lives (rather than bending forwards slightly) so it does look lovely to me - but - hardly profess knowledge about any of this stuff. However I don't intend for her to become an "ice skater" - its a hobby that she loves more than anything else in the world and it doesn't matter if she is not particularly good! I could see her loving doing some shows maybe for a year before she goes to university (if she skates that long)!

If she is good at dance, I hope she's not lost for good because of one hurtful comment from a boy. 12 is very young still. I know a lot of skaters who don't switch from free to dance until they're older teens (look at John Kerr). And if you're intention is for her to "skate" rather than to become an "ice skater" why not continue doing both? I think the best free skaters are the one who do dance lessons as well, just because the attention to detail in dance isn't there in free.

skatingmum2 · September 02, 2011, 04:48:43 PM

I think the boy was part of it - but - after she was dumped the ice dance coach couldn't look at her or talk to her for weeks (and he rapidly disappeared each time I tried to approach him and all I wanted to ask was whether they could look at different goals and did he still want to coach her) , the other dance parents avoided us - that probably hurt as much as the boy. I know people felt awkward but it was absolutely ghastly. Probably like a couple getting divorced and everybody siding with the other partner. Yes - her leg extensions now not as beautiful as previously - but - we'll see. Its really her choice...(We had to do a lot of hard work to preserve self esteem - yes - her weight had increased but she was and still is very slim - slimmer than many ice skaters and the boy told her she was fat and heavy... her initial response was maybe she needed to stop eating).

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Landing position