Blade recommendations - fsf

[JimStanmore]

dak_rbb
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Post Title: Blade recommendations
Posted: 06-24-2010, 02:07 AM

Okay, I know there are a lot of posts about what blade to get, etc., but even after spending quite a bit of time searching around the forums, I'm still unsure. My daughter is getting new skates and, while her current blades (MK Professionals) would fit the new skates, they're wearing down and our skate tech recommended that she get new blades as well. Her coach had first said to stick with the Professional as she is doing well, but then suggested that maybe we might want to go to Paramounts. The extra expense would be offset by money/time/gas saved in sharpening and it would be a step up in blade. I think the coach would really like her in a more "advanced" blade, but also would like to save us money (not a bad thing!).

So we were ready to make the leap to Paramounts, but after researching this, I think they don't make them any smaller than 8.25" and dd needs 8" blades. So, my question is... Should we upgrade or just stick with Professionals for now?

My daughter just turned 9. She can do all her doubles (including Axel, if you ask her--I'm not so sure). However, she's competing preliminary and I'd say her double flip and lutz are a good 6 months at least from being ready for competition. I think her current blade is fine for now, but a new blade will last for another 9-10 months. Should we upgrade now or wait until next year? Any opinions? 

sk8tmum
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Posted: 06-24-2010, 07:33 AM

Simple: ask the coach. Equipment questions should be directed to her coach; s/he will give you advice. There are lots of issues in terms of switching blades, and in the timing of doing so, and the coach is directly affected by this factor. Our coach, for example, would tell you to not switch blades on new boots, but, instead to try new blades on boots that are already comfortable and broken in (not down). Then again, she actively dislikes Paramounts, and we would receive quite a bit of negative feedback if we were to purchase them. Like many coaches, she has her personal preferences for what equipment her skater uses and we respect that.

Also in terms of the Paramounts: something that may seem quite odd - I have had feedback from a few judges that the "coloured" ones are distracting and they don't like them. Just something to consider.

What's funny for Canadians - Preliminary is quite low level, our first real "test level" and the skaters are limited to doing an axel and one of the 2T or 2S, and you often see them not able to do either ! 

kssk8fan
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Posted: 06-24-2010, 07:54 AM

If your daughter is doing all of her doubles including the double axel in the MK professionals, I would stick with that blade as it seems to be working. 

Isk8NYC
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Posted: 06-24-2010, 10:05 AM

I would move her current blades to the new boots. Once the boots are broken in, you can make the choice of new blade with the coach. This spreads out the adjustment period and lets the boots break in properly without interference.

Make sure that your sharpener has the right equipment to sharpen the Paramounts. If there are other skaters at the rink wearing those blades, there should be no issue. Some pro shops charge more for the "runner style" blades' sharpening and skaters often buy two pairs of blades so they always have a sharp pair available.

Do the math to be sure you're actually saving money in the long run. Sometimes what seems to be a good deal ends up costing more money when you add everything up for the life of the blades. 

dak_rbb
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Posted: 06-24-2010, 10:08 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by sk8tmum 
Simple: ask the coach. Equipment questions should be directed to her coach; s/he will give you advice... !


I've been speaking with the coach about it and she was the one that brought up the possibility of switching to Paramount at this point. I'll definitely ask at the next lesson so we can decide. However dd's coach does not portray herself as an equipment expert. She tends to stick with the blades she used (prof, phantom, gold seal) and I like to go into these decisions with as much info as possible.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sk8tmum 
What's funny for Canadians - Preliminary is quite low level, our first real "test level" and the skaters are limited to doing an axel and one of the 2T or 2S, and you often see them not able to do either !


Here skaters can and do compete with two of the first three doubles at prelim and then add the flip and lutz in pre-juv. These seem to be the "try out your new doubles" levels with lots of not-so-good jumps and falls. 

dak_rbb
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Posted: 06-24-2010, 10:10 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by kssk8fan 
If your daughter is doing all of her doubles including the double axel in the MK professionals, I would stick with that blade as it seems to be working.


That's a good point and probably what we'll end up doing. It may be better timing to switch blades in 9 months anyway--though it's hard to time this stuff with growing feet! 

dak_rbb
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Posted: 06-24-2010, 10:16 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Isk8NYC 
I would move her current blades to the new boots. Once the boots are broken in, you can make the choice of new blade with the coach. This spreads out the adjustment period and lets the boots break in properly without interference.


That's a great suggestion. Thanks for the input.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Isk8NYC 
Make sure that your sharpener has the right equipment to sharpen the Paramounts. If there are other skaters at the rink wearing those blades, there should be no issue. Some pro shops charge more for the "runner style" blades' sharpening and skaters often buy two pairs of blades so they always have a sharp pair available.

Do the math to be sure you're actually saving money in the long run. Sometimes what seems to be a good deal ends up costing more money when you add everything up for the life of the blades.


Thanks. I've actually checked on all this and I was starting to look forward to not making the 2 hr RT drive through traffic every 3-4 weeks for sharpening. However, we just got the skates and the Paramounts are not an option because they don't come small enough. I was just wondering if we should upgrade the blade to something else that DOES come in 8" size. 

Isk8NYC
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Posted: 06-24-2010, 10:33 AM

She's done really well on the MK Pros. The next step up in the MK line would be the MK Phantom. Both have a 7' rocker.

I looked at changing blades a few months ago myself, but ended up moving a blade I already owned that was still-new. Lots of good tips on that thread, including the fact that Jackson/Ultima makes a Phantom clone called the "Ultima Freestyle." I think it has an 8' rocker, though, so how do they consider that to be the same profile? I dunno...but the price is good and many people like the Ultima blades.

Tidewater Ice has MK blades on sale, maybe you could get a good deal on new MK Pros or Phantoms from them? Just be sure to check on the availability before you order - there are far fewer sizes available now than there were the last time I looked.

http://www.tidewaterice.com/mdsblades.htm 

isakswings
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Posted: 06-24-2010, 12:47 PM

Sorry to the OP but I am going to hijack this post a bit...

Anyone else have issues with Ultima blades needing frequent sharpenings? Dd was in Jackson Freestyle boots with a Mark IV blade and I swear, I had to sharpen that blade much more frequently then I had to sharpen her MK 21's and Wilson Jubilee blades. She wasn't skating as much when she used the MK 21's, so that is likely part of the reason for not needing frequent sharpenings. However, she is now in a Jackson Competitor boot with a Mirage blade and I feel like I am having to sharpen that blade ALL the time. Makes me crazy. LOL! Of coarse, recently, dd has been skating 4+ days and 2+ hours a day to prepare for the comp last week. I know part of the problem is not always wearing her hard guards when off ice... we are working on that! Still... I swear we have to sharpen these blades much more frequently then the MK and Wilson blades we've owned. Anyone else notice this?

To the OP... my daughter's friend skate prelim and is doing most of the same jumps your daughter is(no, double axel tho... lol!) and is skating on professional blades. She does very well in those and I am hoping to buy the same blades for my daughter too. There are several skaters at our rink who use those blades. I've heard great things about them. Happy shopping! 

RachelSk8er
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Posted: 06-24-2010, 02:17 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by isakswings 
Sorry to the OP but I am going to hijack this post a bit...

Anyone else have issues with Ultima blades needing frequent sharpenings? Dd was in Jackson Freestyle boots with a Mark IV blade and I swear, I had to sharpen that blade much more frequently then I had to sharpen her MK 21's and Wilson Jubilee blades.


No, I had the exact opposite experience. I was in various Wilson blades for years (from about 1990-2004), and switched to Ultimas up until this past March when I went to MK Gold Stars. I found the Ultimas needed sharpened less frequently than the Wilsons or MKs, even though I kept them at a more shallow hollow because they were only used for dance and synchro, no jumping/spinning. (On my current amount of skating, it's at about 4 or 5 weeks for the MKs when I was going more like 6-7 on the Ultimas). 

dak_rbb
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Posted: 06-24-2010, 02:21 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by isakswings 
Sorry to the OP but I am going to hijack this post a bit...

Anyone else have issues with Ultima blades needing frequent sharpenings?


It seems like I've heard that Ultima blades need LESS frequent sharpening?? Maybe the higher level Ultimas hold the sharpening longer?

Quote:
Originally Posted by isakswings 
To the OP... my daughter's friend skate prelim and is doing most of the same jumps your daughter is(no, double axel tho... lol!) and is skating on professional blades...


I should clarify: dd SAYS she can do a double Axel. I just roll my eyes. Maybe she's done a few, but it's not something they're working on seriously yet. 

Isk8NYC
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Posted: 06-24-2010, 02:24 PM

The MK 21/Jubilee blades are made of harder steel than the Ultima Mark IV. That might be why the Mark IV's need sharpening more often than the others. The Mirage should be on par with the Jubilee in terms of quality materials, but I don't have any personal experience with that blade, sorry.

Not wearing guards to walk around, flushing the toilet with bare blades, and stepping on the white plastic threshold to the ice all dull blades quickly. Perhaps those could be causes? 

isakswings
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Posted: 06-24-2010, 07:25 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Isk8NYC 
The MK 21/Jubilee blades are made of harder steel than the Ultima Mark IV. That might be why the Mark IV's need sharpening more often than the others. The Mirage should be on par with the Jubilee in terms of quality materials, but I don't have any personal experience with that blade, sorry.

Not wearing guards to walk around, flushing the toilet with bare blades, and stepping on the white plastic threshold to the ice all dull blades quickly. Perhaps those could be causes?


Thanks! I think lack of guards might be contirbuting to the problem. All I know is she has had the same habits when she wore the other blades and we didn't seem to need to have her skates sharpened as frequently.

She's only been in the Competitors for a couple of months BUT her skates are hand me downs from another skater. They have pleanty of edge left on them but if I continue to have the same issue, I will replace them.

Thanks again 

isakswings
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Posted: 06-24-2010, 07:27 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by RachelSk8er 
No, I had the exact opposite experience. I was in various Wilson blades for years (from about 1990-2004), and switched to Ultimas up until this past March when I went to MK Gold Stars. I found the Ultimas needed sharpened less frequently than the Wilsons or MKs, even though I kept them at a more shallow hollow because they were only used for dance and synchro, no jumping/spinning. (On my current amount of skating, it's at about 4 or 5 weeks for the MKs when I was going more like 6-7 on the Ultimas).


Interesting! I used to be able to go 6 to 7 weeks between her sharpenings when she was in her wilson blades. She stopped using those skates a year ago, so she was doing some jumps and spins but nothing like she is doing now. Maybe that is part of the differece? I dunno but it frustrates me. 

isakswings
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Posted: 06-24-2010, 07:29 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by dak_rbb 
It seems like I've heard that Ultima blades need LESS frequent sharpening?? Maybe the higher level Ultimas hold the sharpening longer?

I should clarify: dd SAYS she can do a double Axel. I just roll my eyes. Maybe she's done a few, but it's not something they're working on seriously yet.


I kinda figured that was the case with her 2 axels. That is cute, I think! Doesn't sound like she is afraid to jump if she even thinks about trying 2 axel! 

[Isk8NYC]

Amazing that the blade models from 2007 are still in use - many have been updated, but the model names and profiles live on!  #throwbackthursday

[Query]

Ultima Mark IV blades are more or less beginner level, in that they usually come pre-mounted on relatively low level boots. They aren't usually sold as separate blades. It isn't fair to judge the whole brand by the bottom of the line.

My own experience is that high end Ultima blades hold their sharpness longer than high end MK and Wilson blades. [I exclude the super-high-end MK and Wilson "Revolution" blades, with which I have no experience.]

[Isk8NYC wrote]:
"Amazing that the blade models from 2007 are still in use - many have been updated, but the model names and profiles live on!"

A local sharpener claims that over 25 year old Wilson "Gold Seal" [or was it MK Gold Star?] blades have a quite different shape from modern blades of the same name. He says the toe pick has moved a lot.