Weak Ankles and Boots

[JSHalo]

Hello, all! I am an adult beginner (I've only had a couple lessons), and I'm planning on eventually getting my own skates instead of using rentals. Due to a connective tissue disorder, I have lax ligaments in both ankles. I feel like I want more support from the boot, but I'm worried about sacrificing the ability to bend my ankles (plus $$$). I was considering getting compression socks (just the ankle), but I've no idea if they would be helpful, and they're fairly expensive to be just sitting around if they don't' work, so I wanted to address the boot issue first, and get some ideas.

Does anybody have experience with weak ankles and skating? Or just ideas in general would be much appreciated! Thanks

[rd350]

Welcome @JSHalo!

Compression stocking will not help at all and I don't think are a good idea.  When you say you have weak ankles, what is happening functionally - are you turning out your ankles and spraining or just have difficulty with stability, or other?

[skategeek]

I'm not all that experienced myself and others may have more useful input, but I'd say if your only experience so far has been with the rentals, you'll find that the difference in support between those and even the lower level freestyle skates is like night and day.  So if you're having issues with support in the rental skates, it's definitely worth getting your own skates.  Ones with low to moderate stiffness should still give you some ankle bend.

[JSHalo]

Thank you!

I do not have problems with spraining my ankles, but like you said, I do have difficulty with stability (not just on the ice, standing/walking in general). So far, I haven't had a lot of trouble, other than I favor my inside edge (may be the rentals). I'll frequently feel a dull aching pain in my ankles due to day-to-day movement. I guess I just want to have proper support through my ankle to avoid any problems since blades are so much more unstable.

[rd350]

I agree you should get your own skates that have ankle stability/are stiffer than most rentals and will fit you correctly.  I'd try and find a respected fitter in your area for the best fit.  As important, you really should work on off ice ankle and core stabilization.  Can you see a good PT to get you started and then work on your own with a good, progressive home exercise program?

[JSHalo]

Good questions. Physical therapy has thus far been insufficient. It started in my ankles and has progressed to my hips, right shoulder, and neck. Surgery was suggested for my shoulder (since it's my dominant arm, it's the one I'm most concerned about). From what I've been told, since this is a collagen issue and not an injury, there's not much to be done. 

I am planning to get a balance board, as I think that will be helpful with long-term use.

[JSM]

I think more supportive skates are definitely in order.  Do you have access to a good skate shop or fitter?

Sorry to hear about your collagen issues.  If you haven't already, see a podiatrist about insoles - not only for skates, but also for your regular shoes.  Proper alignment is so very important for using the right muscles!

[JSHalo]

JSM, there's a pro shop about 2 hours away, and a local coach who sells skates... both only work with Riedell. The next closest shop is 4 hours away (they also appear to only have Riedell). I'm willing to make the 2 hour trip just to try on different styles of boot.

[Loops]

Riedells are good skates.....if you have a Riedell foot.  So I think it's a good idea for you to travel to try on other brands.  You never know!

Good luck with this!  Sorry to hear about your issues.  A woman I skate with has serious issues resulting from a bout with meningitis as a child.  She's lucky to be a live, actually, but as a result she has the knees of an 80 year old, and needs artificial ones (but she's putting that off as long as possible).  Skating has done more good for her than PT, although she keeps that up too, simply by helping her get and stay strong and develop her balance, and everything else that comes with it.  Hopefully you'll have the same experience!

[rd350]

Just a word about PT.  There's , great, good, not so good and bad PT and the difference is night and day.  So not sure what you've done.  I treated someone with a similar issue long long ago so it's not unfamiliar (different types and causes though of course, as well as level it affects people).

I can't vouch for every therapist on this list but the program is very high level and certification is very challenging so they are very high level PT's.  Maybe there's someone near you.  http://www.instituteofphysicalart.com/ipa/referral/list

Most people can benefit really targeted strengthening and stability work (certainly no cure!).  Until you get a balance board you could try simpler things like single leg stance, progress to standing on a soft surface; tossing a ball against the wall and catching.... to your ability and tolerance of course!

It's awesome you can skate.  I would definitely travel for more options in skates if you can, just because different brands will be better for different feet.  I have Reidell's that never quite fit right and finally just got much better fitting skates.  Big difference.  In your case, anything with good support that fits YOU should be a step up from the rentals.

Good luck!

[JSHalo]

Thank you, everybody, for being so helpful!

And thank you for the PT info! It is more than worth looking into. I will investigate the link you provided, and maybe my shoulder specialist will have options other than those I've been using.

[Query]

There is such a thing as going over-board on supportive skates.

When your skates are too stiff, the force that your feet and ankles would have absorbed is transferred on up the kinetic chain to legs and knees and hips, etc. That would be especially true if you have too much trouble pointing and flexing your foot, forward and back, inside the boot.

Also, too-stiff boots will weaken your ankles in the long term, because you won't be using your body to resist injury, and body parts that aren't stressed grow weak. OTOH, relatively stiff boots can give your ankles enough of a rest from injury for them to recover in the short term.

I used to sprain my ankles on a near-weekly basis, backpacking.

I took up skating to strengthen my ankles. Eventually it worked. But first I broke a leg while skating. In a fall that wasn't fast enough to break everything - which means the injury was caused probably by my own muscle tension, rather than the impact, which I suspect is very common.

BTW good skate fit is also extremely important to injury prevention. If you can slide around inside the boot, or if some part of your foot isn't adequately supported, or if the place where the insole bends isn't underneath the ball of your foot (where your foot is designed to bend), those are also good ways to get hurt. It probably didn't help any that my toes and ankle-bones are relatively wide compared to my heels, so I was wearing boots that were too wide everywhere else, including my heels, which everyone says should fit snugly to prevent injuries.

The most important thing that stopped my succession of injuries was learning how to fall gently, and how to regain balance by means that didn't involve extreme muscle tension. I used to fight falls so hard, that I think that extreme muscle was what caused both the sprained ankles (i.e., they may actually have been sprained muscle injuries), and the broken leg. I'm well known here for advocating fall practice.

But everyone finds their own solutions to injury prevention. If boots do it for you, go ahead.

[sarahspins]

Balance boards are great for helping improve both your reflexes AND the strength of the muscles used to support the ankles, ligaments aside.  They are also a ton of fun to just goof off on. 

We have 3 different ones, an indo board, a bongo board, and the weird one (Drift) that Quirky came out with (that went on sale for $20 last year - that's why I have one when I already had the other two, I just can't resist a good deal on something that looks like fun, but it's not being sold any more).  Of the 3, I would say the indo board is easiest, but the bongo board is more dynamic (it rocks front/back as well as rolling side to side) and I prefer it.  The Drift is the more difficult of the 3 for me, but my kids seem to think it's easier - I think it's because they are all much lighter than I am and they tend to keep their weight over the stationary part, rather than in the middle.

Back to skates though, it's important that you be properly fitted no matter what you end up with.  Riedell does make good skates, so don't immediately eliminate them as an option just because that's all that is available locally.  ANY skating boots beyond the basic recreational-only models are going to offer much more support than any rental skate does, so you really don't need to concern yourself with buying "more" boot to compensate for your own perception of having weak ankles, you need to focus more on buying something that is appropriate for your current level/ability/strength, and that fits well - after your first pair, then you can better evaluate what you need in your next pair of skates.  If you do get skates with leather soles you will also have the option to get your blades adjusted if they aren't in the right position for you - and since everyone has different feet and centers of gravity, this is a very common thing to have to do.  Footbed support is also important, and some issues like pronation or falling to an inside edge constantly can be corrected just by supporting the foot better, not just by moving the blades.

Query makes a good point about skating in a boot that is "too stiff" for you.  Many of us adults do skate in boots that are rated "above" our level, but our own skating history has shown us that we actually need the extra support, we didn't simply start off there - usually what happens is that we've broken down a pair of skates that fit correctly much sooner than expected (poor fit can also accelerate break-down though, so that is something to be aware of), so we moved up in strength for the next pair.  It's actually better to be slightly underbooted than to be significantly overbooted... because the risk of boot-related injury aside, if you can't bend your ankles easily, a lot of skills are much more difficult or even bordering on impossible to learn since you will be fighting the boot that doesn't want to bend.   As a beginning adult though, you can safely consider boot options that are a level or two above what is suggested for a child, but I wouldn't suggest anything beyond that.  Most kids wouldn't be able to bend a Jackson Freestyle as a beginner for example, but most beginning adults do just fine in them - as long as they fit well.  A really good test to tell if a boot is too stiff for you when you try them on is to bend your knees while standing - if you can't push your knees past your toes as you look down, or without your heels lifting up and rocking your foot forward, then the boots are too stiff.  Likewise, if it's much too easy that may be an indication that you need a little more support and could try the next model up.

[Query]

I've never tried a balance board. Closest I've come was trying to balance on those foam cylinders they have at gyms - I've never figured out what they are for. Trying to stand balanced on them is fun - but I think they might be an easy way to hurt yourself, as you are frequently thrown into a fall.  I've also tried standing on the inflatable exercise balls - with little success, and a lot of falls.

I'm sorry I didn't read carefully enough, and assumed you had frequent ankle sprains. Misfit shoes and boots could possibly explain stability problems - physics says you need pressure on the shoe or boot, in all directions, to control it. If there are low pressure points in the shoe, those are places that you lose control. For example, you might have a foot slant that doesn't match the bottom or sides of typical shoes. A good sports PT or podiatrist could make you orthotics, for a big fee. You likely need separate orthotics for shoes and skates. It may help to see a sports PT or podiatrist who specializes in sports medicine, including sports performance. Talk to people in sports communities that deal a lot with their feet - e.g., runners, dancers. The medical specialists that they recommend for dealing with athletic feet problems are most likely to have some idea what they are doing. And they might be able to tell you whether shoe fit is an issue that affects your balance.

I will also send you a link to how to make your own orthotic substitutes, if you want to go cheap, or feel you can do a better job yourself, because you can feel for yourself what is happening.

I hope you do find a good solution. Skating is very balance oriented, and trying to skate may be good practice in itself - but may be frustrating if balance is a major problem for you.

P.S. Please tie your laces tight - and use all the holes and hooks, crossing between each level. You would be surprised how many people have trouble balancing with loose laces. Especially at ice rinks. I try to get about 15-20 pounds of tension on the laces throughout. If you can jam a finger under the lace after it is tied - it is way too lose.

[JSHalo]

What great info! Thank you SO much!

I found a wobble board, which has 360* range of motion (versus just back and forth like some do), and it's been great to use while I'm at work. I can stand in front of the counter if I need to catch myself, but if I tip too far, it just touches down and I don't feel like I'm going to fall off of it. So far, so good! I can rock in a bunch of different directions, do circles, etc., so I hope this will help build up some strength.

Orthotics... I've never looked into them; in fact, I really haven't even thought about it for my ankles.

As far as falling goes, I'm not a very graceful faller. I did quite a bit of martial arts as a kid, and riding horses has taught me to roll into the fall, but skating has a totally different type of momentum that I will have to figure out.