Incredible Edger sharpening machine

[R45]

Before IE I had copy of SSM. It had similar "stepless" balanging washer. Balancing was a real nigthmare task. Getting the wheel in to balance is comparable to winning in the lottery.

You are right sometimes it can be troublesome. Some wheels go fast; others can take some time to get the vibrations out of it.
As I mentioned, when the wheel wears off it has to get re-balanced after some time, but the correction stays around the same area, this doesn't take much time.
I will make a balancer tool like you did to define the heaviest and lightest part of the wheel. Then I can mark the wheel and move the balancing ring forward only instead of all around.

[Kaitsu]

Just noted that pictures which I have uploaded before forum update are no longer working. Here is picture how IE spinle cartridge looks when it is dismantled.

[tstop4me]

Just noted that pictures which I have uploaded before forum update are no longer working.

Yeah, I had opened a thread on this problem over a year ago.  https://skatingforums.com/index.php?topic=8935.0  .  I had also DM'd the Admin for an update this past July, but no response.  So I guess all those pre-update attachments are gone for good.

[Qsior]

IE and I are starting to like each other ;-) more and more. What do you think about this method of checking wheel balance and choosing the appropriate shims?

[Kaitsu]

What do you think about this method of checking wheel balance and choosing the appropriate shims?

See this thread, post #18 and http://skatingforums.com/index.php?topic=8710.0

My experiences about these phone apps is that they are more like a joke than usable tools. I have already removed this app from my phone and I could not find easily those videos or pictures I took while testing the app. When I introduced the app to our company vibration messurement experts, they got good laughts.

My 3D printed wheel balancer, my eyes and ears, as well as what I can feel with my hands has been so far most reliable methods. You will learn also this if you balance your wheel like I do. When balaced wheel wears, you will notice that its more difficult to get good surface finish. You will be surpriced when you realize how small unbalance starts to affect to your grinding quality. IE is super sensitive due it's construction. Low mass = high the vibration sensitivity.

[Qsior]

  and again, as usual, you are right
these apps are actually toys
maybe some professional vibration meter?

I have a magnetic RC balancer, it should be enough for now. Right?

https://a.aliexpress.com/_Eze5GSc

What do you think about using IE shims on such a balancer?
e.g. only for IE wheels ( as You wrote, Rubys are very unbalanced)

[Qsior]

This is probably not normal :-(
what could be the cause?
It looks like they put the belt on backwards at the factory?

Kaitsu , have you found in Europe any good substitutes?

[Qsior]

I have one spare belt ,
This is Gates 3M355
I'm just looking....

[marc]

I'd like to know the reference number of this ICE fine grinding wheel? And if it's available in France/Europe, because I've been using the Blademaster for a year now and I'm very happy with it.

[Qsior]

This is probably not normal :-(
what could be the cause?
It looks like they put the belt on backwards at the factory?

Kaitsu , have you found in Europe any good substitutes?

I've included a picture of the belt in post #94. It shows that the belt was seated correctly. I don't know, maybe it got twisted? I don't know where the problem is. :-(

I found the belts on eBay but they don't ship to Europe

[Qsior]

I ordered Banflex 3M355 Bando,
About 10€ netto,

[Kaitsu]

I don't know, maybe it got twisted?

Unfortunately it´s hard to imagine any other possibility than you have removed the belt and in the installation phase it has turned up-side-down. I don't think its possible that it turns while machine is running. At least I have never seen it to happen. As you already concluded, belt tooths should point outwards. See videos
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hKip_lDyBUc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p2xwTO4X3EA

Belt installation is also instructed in the Skateology manual. Did you get that book together with the machine?

In the beginning I used exactly same magnetic RC balancer than you. Since it had few problem areas, I made my own version. Main problems were the shaft runout, those conical shaped blue nuts which should center the wheel and missing width adjustment. Cones didn't center / align the wheel like I wanted and new wheel was a bit too heavy for the magnets. Basic principle in my own balancer is same. I have just tried to improve the shaft to more be accurate, magnets are stronger and I can adjust magnets distance. Adjustment allows shaft length vary more than in fixed design.

[Kaitsu]

I'd like to know the reference number of this ICE fine grinding wheel? And if it's available in France/Europe, because I've been using the Blademaster for a year now and I'm very happy with it.

What I know, IE does not have distributor for machines or supplies here in the Europe. Items are stocked only in US.

I am not sure what you means with refence number. If you are referring to grit size, its not state on the wheels or in the web pages.
https://www.incredibleedger.com/incredible-edger-price-list
https://web.archive.org/web/20170228101745/http://iceskateology.com/Skateology/Price_List.html

In the Skateology manual Sid did mention that Fine equals to Grit 100, Medium 80 and coarse 60. I am not sure if US is following same grit standards as here in Europe. Its good to note that grit size alone is not defining how smooth surface you can get. Your diamond tip condition, the way how you dress the wheel and blade material affect a lot.

If you want to test White wheels, buy them from Blademaster. As per as my experiences, Blademaster wheels makes slightly better surface finish than IE fine (white) wheels, even both are balanced. ICE fine makes more easily chatter mark traces. I still have more than 10pc of white ICE Fine wheels on my own stock. Marc, how small wheels you can use? I do have plenty of worn-out wheels which are too small for my machine.

[Qsior]

Unfortunately it´s hard to imagine any other possibility than you have removed the belt and in the installation phase it has turned up-side-down. I don't think its possible that it turns while machine is running. At least I have never seen it to happen. As you already concluded, belt tooths should point outwards. See videos
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hKip_lDyBUc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p2xwTO4X3EA

Yes I saw it, I watched it several times.;-)
the belt was already in the machine, I didn't move it, maybe it got damaged during transport, it looks like it was cut in a couple of places

Belt installation is also instructed in the Skateology manual. Did you get that book together with the machine?

yes I have a book . :-)
I will replace the belt and check if the pulleys are not damaged or small scratches.

[Qsior]

I installed a new belt, checked the tension, and it was fine.
Unfortunately, after sharpening one skate, the belt twisted. As it twists, it starts to bend in certain places and then cut. I don't know what's going on. Is the tension weak? Maybe a manufacturing defect?
 ��I don't like the sound of the main shaft. Could it be the bearings?

https://youtube.com/shorts/1YjF0Ac1AAY?feature=shared

https://youtube.com/shorts/cUysjWUHdFc?si=ajb6GaxGcaU8o198

https://youtube.com/shorts/nI7_IGtKelo?si=57PAODDvI_HaM5jb

https://youtube.com/shorts/AfotLg8j89o?si=ru0dxKEjxwCpX6rz

[Kaitsu]

Qsior, I own you a apologies. I was claiming that you have done some mistake, but clearly your machine does have something seriously wrong. I suggest you contact seller as I see this to be warranty case.

If you want to try diagnose issue by your selves, remove the spindle cartridge and shake it like I do it on video. My spare cartridge was delivered so that nut at the bottom, which tightens the bearings was loosen. Spindle should not keep the rattling noise like in my video. If nut is loosen, your spindle shaft might move up and down which causes misalignment between the pulley wheels. Loosen nut might also explain the noise you mention.

https://youtu.be/prWXChtowas

[Qsior]

Kaitsu,
Thank you very much for your reply and the video.
Could the problem be the motor shaft bearings? I have the impression that something is rattling there. If the bearings are damaged, they will cause the main wheel to wobble. The situation will be similar to what you described with the spindle cartridge. Am I right? I'll also check the cartridge.

https://youtube.com/shorts/A7gSoMJa3Oo?si=z027PPYW7rdJDgJK

[Qsior]

I got a quick reply from IE that my videos show the cartridge is too high, it should be a flash with casting, and that's why the wheels aren't aligned.
I don't think so.:-(

[Kaitsu]

Pulley wheels missalignement is what I thought too. That is why I took these photos, but based on your videos alignement does not look so bad. If your spindle is too high or too low, also wheel becomes uneven when you dress it. ROH is corret but blade will not hit in to the middle of the wheel.

I was also wondering if your bigger pulley wheel is wobling or is it just a video which makes it to look like it's wobbling. You comment was confirming that my eyes are seeing wrongly. Is it loosen?

It seems there is some troubles to attach pictures to this thread so I will send them to your WA.

[Woofoo]

As Kaitsu said, It would be good to look at the 1) Spindle 2) Driving Wheel and 3) the Motor Bearing in turn. Since the problem would be easier to handle in this order of work.
If you find your spindle bearing out of weck. Ask them to replace it.
If you Tighten the lock Screw of the Driving Wheel and suddenly seen the problem solved. Congratulation.
If you have done all this and the problem persist(without connect the Wheel and the cartridge and noise as you shown still persist). It 99percent is the Motor bearing.
I have once bought an Noisy Motor from them so I opened the inside of Motor and found out that the bearings are C3 standard. It's for the closed environment that can shut out the Grinding residue contamination without increase the temperature to the limit that might hurt the bearing and the operation of the machine. But it does sometimes cause problem.
I have changed the bearing and see if it work in the following month.
And good luck to you.

Woofoo

[Kaitsu]

I got a quick reply from IE that my videos show the cartridge is too high, it should be a flash with casting, and that's why the wheels aren't aligned.
I don't think so.:-(

Also in my opinion spindle is in right height. Arrow they have drawn into the still image points to the wrong plane. Skatelogogy manual says following: Aligning surfaces A and B will locate the the wheel (height wise) reasonally correctly respect to the diamond - you may need to adjust very slightly up or down to acquire optimum location.

[Qsior]

Unfortunately, it's not my fault
what do you think?


https://youtube.com/shorts/lw14bTPOFF4?si=mlTzAm97E-OIKlTi

https://youtube.com/shorts/fbWozqvKyTo?si=nWlzfscOgchsX5_J

https://youtube.com/shorts/qClEsyfAAjA?si=fyOa3dDhE11Yn1ld

[Qsior]

Kaitsu,
especially since You set the cartridge low and nothing happens to the belt

[Qsior]

I have once bought an Noisy Motor from them so I opened the inside of Motor and found out that the bearings are C3 standard. It's for the closed environment that can shut out the Grinding residue contamination without increase the temperature to the limit that might hurt the bearing and the operation of the machine. But it does sometimes cause problem.
I have changed the bearing and see if it work in the following month.
And good luck to you.

Woofoo

Thank You Woofoo for this pro tip .
so it was the Incredible edger moto?
C3 ? Really ? this is more than C0.
I think they should give that not C3 .
And what bearings did you use? C3 or CN ( without markings)

[Woofoo]

Qsior,

I have change the bearings to a pair of Amazon listed and claimed to be of the ABEC-9 standard and CN or C0. However, when I run it without install to the chassis, it still have some slightly humming. It seems decrease in time and I would see.

For you I would recommend to try Some "Hybrid ceramic ball bearing with at Least ABEC-7 and CN". It is because it would not prone to generate too much heat in the process to hurt the machine operation. And this is what I intend to change to if the current bearing doesn't work. Sure it would be a little expensive.

Anyway, Good Luck.

And thanks for Kaitsu to facilitate this thread of forum for us and his contribution is invaluable.

Woofoo