Chasing my Sanity

[4711]

And considering that St Jude has thrown in the towel a long time ago....

regardless:
I have seen - somewhere - a list of possible jump combinations. All neatly abbreviated, letters and numbers.
But now, for the life of me, I can't find it anymore. I think it was here on the forum (but could have been one of the other two, which are not as nice...but I peek anyhow, in the quest for knowledge)
So, what are the possible/likely jump combinations? Obviously nobody would put an Axel in the end of one...

Skates:
they seem to be pretty indestructible - unless you try to crack open coconuts with them I guess.
Do they ever wear out?
If you had deep pockets and unlimited ice time, would you own more than one pair of the same kind (so you could do it as the experts suggest for other foot ware and let them dry out in between uses)

Any pointers on where to look for sanity?

Your help is much appreciated. 

[Skittl1321]

Jump combos - you can tack a toe loop or loop onto anything, because of the way these take off.  So any jump, plus either of those is pretty much the list.   If you can jump CW and CCW in theory you could add a lutz onto a jump for a combo, doing it the 'other' way. This is really rare both because it is hard, and because of the way repeated jumps are limited in programs you 'waste' your lutz.   You can't add a flip, because you would need your landing leg to use for the toe pick entry if you go the same way, or because you are on the outside edge when you land, and the flip takes off from the inside (if you wanted to rotate in the opposite direction).  You can't add a salchow or an axel because you would have to step.

Skates definetly wear out. The most common reason is creasing at the ankles and they lose their support.
I wouldn't use more than one pair of skates at a time because the blade feel can be really difficult to adjust to.  But I might have 'dance skates' and 'freestyle skates'.


Sanity- perhaps on look at a nice Carribean beach?


ETA: You might be interested inthe scale of values, which has all the abbreviations.
http://www.usfigureskating.org/Content/201112-S&P-SOVs.pdf

Jump combos you add the full value of the points of each jump.
Jump sequences only get 80% of the value combined total of jumps.  A sequence is a lot like a combo, but the jumps are linked together by unlisted jumps or hops.  It also can't include turns or steps.

[4711]

Thank you so much.
(I should have saved it when I found it...)

Incidentally I was supposed to sit on the beach this week, alas...

[sarahspins]

I've seen a coach at our rink do a one foot axel (lands on opposite foot) right into both a double salchow and a double flip (obviously not at the same time)... so there are different combos out there, they just involve jumps that aren't common.

Axels are appearing in a lot of sequences this season, as is the half loop into 3sal.

Skates definitely wear out.  A lot of the coaches at my rink who are still skating for themselves (working on moves or freeskate tests) usually have one pair of skates for skating, and keep another old pair for coaching.  Some skaters may have a separate pair for dance or synchro.  Some people manage to switch between skates with ease, others have more trouble... and I think it does get easier the more you do it, but I don't know of any skater who has multiple pairs of skates they rotate through for freeskate.

[AgnesNitt]

Skates definitely wear out.  A lot of the coaches at my rink who are still skating for themselves (working on moves or freeskate tests) usually have one pair of skates for skating, and keep another old pair for coaching.  Some skaters may have a separate pair for dance or synchro.  Some people manage to switch between skates with ease, others have more trouble... and I think it does get easier the more you do it, but I don't know of any skater who has multiple pairs of skates they rotate through for freeskate.

I know a coach who teaches in hockey skates for comfort, and figure skates in regular skates.

[Doubletoe]

The half loop is now counted as a single loop jump under IJS, so anything including half loop-salchow or half loop-flip is now considered a jump combination, not a jump sequence.  That's why we're seeing a lot more of them at the national and world level.  Before, a 3F+1/2 Lo+3S would have been counted as a sequence and only valued as 80% of the combined value of the 3F + 3S.  Now it counts as 100% of the value of 3F + 1Lo + 3S, although it also counts as the skater's one 3-jump combination.

[Robin]

Sanity is way overrated.

[4711]

Sanity is way overrated.

yes, I suppose so.

[4711]

Alright, Sanity done left the building:

for your reading pleasure: The Short Program
Skated to the music of 'The Black Mages' or something similar to that (that was on my playlist, random loop...)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YDlYtFpEHAA&playnext=1&list=PL6BE1C0F958B8261D&feature=results_main

Pre-story:

Guy meets girl, girl gets dumped on her head (pairs, bad fall, broken leg/concussion)
guy has to skate his program later in the day, has a surprising fall during warmup.

(all of that is subject to edit -  - I just wish I could actually edit  )


Please do go through it with the big red marker, and be honest to the point of brutality.

I can't take it, I know, but no pain no gain, right!

Thank you.

(you won't have to suffer through such a long paragraph for the long, I swear, because nobody can bare to watch him skate  )

The guy is a bit of a Gary Sue, I know....but I think I found a skater who can be (one of)  his role models....Did I mention I love you guys?
for now anyhow until you hit me in the head with your skates for being such a hack 

[4711]

With another deep breath he skated to the center as the announcer called his name 'Wesley XXX, USA.'
He had selected a very hard rocking instrumental, originally composed for video games. It had taken a while to edit it down to just the right parts, but in the end Wesley had been pleased with the results. It was rather unusual music, and since the gamed had been released quiet a while ago, he did not think many people would remember the  themes.
He found his place and waited for the music to start. The black ink on his palm tingled a bit. A quick glance and one last deep breath and the music started.

He started off with a quick transition into his step sequence. Coming around the corner Wesley picked up speed before he set up for his first jump. Triple Axel. The crowd cheered as he landed with perfect extension. The first of his spins went well before he again picked up speed for the next jump. Wesley dug in deep on that outside edge as he reached back with his right leg to let the toe pick catch the ice as he launched himself into the air for a quadruple lutz. A slight wobble on the landing caused him to grunt dissatisfied. But there was no time to dwell on it. The following split jump was one of his signature moves, high up in the air, the legs extended to a wide V. Quickly he followed with a quadruple Salchow and a triple loop, it almost was a four jump combination. The second spin turned out as well as the first one. Going spread eagle on the outside edges of his skates, his feet pointing in opposite directions on a straight line he allowed himself a short breather before the grand finale. All that was left now was to complete the jump spin. With a  big butterfly leap he settled into the rotation. Wesley was breathing hard as he stopped along with the music. To the cheers of the audience flowers rained on him again as well as stuffed animals. All in all he was satisfied. He glanced up at his team mates. They were cheering at him wile Ariel gave him two thumbs up. Wesley acknowledged her with a quick nod. A big ladybug plush toy fell in front of him as he turned for the exit. For a moment Wesley hesitated, then he picked it up. The young girls were already swarming the ice collecting the offerings for him as he sat down on the bench next to Pete, impatiently waiting for the scores.

[Janie]

It seems a little weird that you give so much detail on specifically what jumps he did, but then you don't mention what the spins are at all. Maybe say what they are to keep everything consistent?

Is this story meant to be realistic for current time? Because quad Lutzes have only happened once at an official ISU competition (in 2011) and not since, so it would be a super big deal if he landed one, you sort of gloss over it as if it was any old jump. And I doubt it would be possible to do it in a 4-jump combo.

And are 4-jump combos even allowed? I only recall seeing 3-jump combos. But I'm not too familiar with the rules, so someone else would have to answer that. Even if it was a allowed though, what he did is a jump sequence, not a combo, since 1) split jump isn't an official jump since it's only half a rotation (I'm not 100% sure on this) 2) You can't add on a salchow as the second jump in a combo since you have to step out because the landing foot is the wrong foot.  Only toe-loops and loops.

[FigureSpins]

Good point, but all spins have begun to look alike, thanks to the pursuit of Level 4 under IJS.

I can recall the layback spins of Peggy and Dorothy, Boitano's camels and any/all of Rohene Wards' spins.  I remember watching Denise Biellman perform her namesake spin, enthralled at the novelty of its position.  Now, every senior tags one on at the end.

Today, all spins are twisting, ever-changing confections that happen too quickly to savor in elite competitions.  That's why I prefer watching shows to comps.

[4711]

well, the sequence will be changed (a double with two jumps after...so not really a foursome) . and excellent point on the spins (to be honest, the jumps I can see, the spins make me fall on my butt sitting on my chair )

Doesn't a leg change 'reverse' the spin? I am assuming spinning to the outside of the leg you are standing on is a back, going to the inside a forward?

Like I said, subject to edit and I appreciate your input! Very much indeed!

bring it! It hurts, but it's the good kind of pain! 

(it is a bit like standing on the ice naked....I don't get much feedback on my dribble normally)

[FigureSpins]

Change of foot doesn't necessarily reverse the spin direction.  The skater can continue to spin in the same CW or CCW direction on the other foot, changing from a forward spin to a backspin or vice versa. 

Most skaters turn CCW on their left foot for forward spins, but others turn CW on their right foot.  A forward spin rotates on a back inside edge at the rocker, not the toepick.  A backspin turns in the same direction on the back inside edge of the opposite foot.  (CCW=right, CW=left)

Skaters can also change edge during a spin, but the direction of rotation and the foot remain the same.  They switch from BO to FI on a backspin, for example.  To the casual fan, its not obvious, but the tch specialist will see the change.

Most skaters spin in the same direction that they rotate during jumps, but even that isn't a hard-and -fast rule.  I know a great skater who competed nationally and spun CW while jumping CCW.

Some skaters can spin in either direction.  In that situation, the skater does change foot and spin direction at the same time - Rohene Ward is known for being able to mix up spins.

[FigureSpins]

If you're doing research for your writing, you should check Wikipedia for technical reference. 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spread_eagle_(figure_skating)

At the bottom of each wiki entry, there's a table with links to various skating elements.  It's maintained by skating enthusiasts and is accurate in its descriptions.  Also, the sk8stuff.com site has a "recognizing elements" page that describes elements and adds a few demo videos.

http://www.sk8stuff.com/m_recognize.htm

Just do me a favor - don't make every male in the story gay.  I know a lot of straight guys who skate, so it would be more interesting to go against the stereotype.

[4711]

Just do me a favor - don't make every male in the story gay.  I know a lot of straight guys who skate, so it would be more interesting to go against the stereotype.

Now that made me laugh hard.

No actually my guys are not gay.
Or rather the ones that matter aren't, what the others do I don't care.
(one of the side gals though is, does that matter?)


I actually do have Wiki on standby and thank you for the other link!

Somewhere I still have my book from when I dreamed big, but translation is a pain

But my eyes do glaze over after a few inside outside edges. I should go skate....but I have the eternal location problem.

[4711]

Ok, more questions:

hanging the medal on the guy:
Does gold gets it first?

I seemed to recall from the olden days they went with bronze first, but I must have seen it wrong.

[Skittl1321]

Now they give the medal to gold first, then silver, then bronze.  I seem to recall it went the other way too...

here is a cereomy if you want to watch: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bHHMNZ4j60A
They also get flowers.

[4711]

thanks! last night was was hunting high and low for some footage and only could find stills...

I think they always got flowers though.

[4711]

More questions.....

I needed 3 pairs so my heroine could go to the big show.
But I am, as I realize, too lazy to write more pairs. I have a total of two pairs (but as I said, I needed three)
Is there a way I can just omit that other pair, like they are not eligible to go? or sprained their noses or something?
(if all fails, I suppose I can invent a couple of silent parts for them....after all I have skipped the Ladies as well, bad me, I know)

Also: My girl fell on her face during the short (I mean knocking her out of competition) how would that influence the other two pairs, in terms of placing to get the coveted extra slots for the following year. Would they still count as three starters or would that give them the slight advantage of not having to score quiet as high in the combined ranks.
I am assuming I am reading this right that the combined rank means that 15th and 13th combine as 28, this giving them 2 slots for the following year.
Dangit this sport is confusing.
On the same note: winning gold does not guarantee your nation 3 slots?

I am also taking name suggestions...I am bad in finding names....

[Skittl1321]

If you don't want 3 pairs to go to world's from your country, one could withdraw due to injury, and if the country has no other pairs that met the minimum technical score, their spot would just be lost (I think it would go to another country).  Or you could just say they didn't meet the minimum technical score themselves, so despite qualifying nationally, they don't get to go.  (Now in the real world they'd be sent to a senior B to try to meet the score, so it would be weird if your federations just leaves them SOL)

Having a pair withdraw from the competition doesn't effect the minimums needed to qualify teams for next year, as when you have 3 teams present, only the top 2 scores matter.   Now, if you had 2 pairs present, and one had a medical withdraw, then I don't know if it still counts as two.  I think if they started it would, but if they withdrew before the competition then the numbers used would be for 1 team present.

Winning does not give you three spots- unless you were the only skater present, then placing in the top 2 gives you two spots.  (For example, if Ten has been the only Kazak skater at World's they would have 3 spots. There was another skater who finished very low, so they only get 2 spots due to their combined total.)

This explains how the numbers work: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Figure_Skating_Championships#Eligibility_and_qualifying
You are right that 13th and 15th would combine to 28 and give 2 spots, if there are 2 or 3 skaters at the championship.  So would 1 and 27th, for instance.

[4711]

thanks.
Skate math is complicated.


Oh well, once I finish the bones I flesh them out, with phone book on hand.

[4711]

Ok, the long program.

i cheated a little, since we do have the 3k limit here:
http://www.campnanowrimo.org/campers/irukazab/novels/thin-ice-64893

the excerpt. I hope you can read it without joining.