Skating with a Star

[AgnesNitt]

Ever take a lesson from a famous skater or a famous coach? Was it worth it? Did you learn anything?

I'll start.

While I was at LP, I took 5 lessons from Todd Gilles US Junior National champ in ice dancing (w/ Trina Pratt)

Worth Every Penny.

I had a couple of breakthroughs and I got some technique I never had before. My coach was all happy face when I got home

He has a good way of dealing with low level skaters, which not every coach does.

[SynchKat]

At my club we have lessons with Brian Orser and Tracy Wilson. Tracy is very technical and always trying new techniques and works on minute details of steps and such.  Brian is more a free spirit and likes to do turns and footwork kind of however the music inspires him. 

Both classes are definitely worth it. 

[jjane45]

Good for you AgnesNitt!! Envy envy envy @ SynchKat...

I have not taken private lessons from star skaters / coaches. Just a clinic with a World Champion skater which was more like overcrowded group lesson ran by rink staff coaches.

I've since wondered if it's worth it to spend $$$ on travel to attend camps for technical improvements. I agree a lot of times it helps tremendously to hear the technique expressed slightly differently, but for someone with tight skating budget, it's too much of a gamble whether or not someone will say something that "clicks"

[SynchKat]

Jjane that is a gamble since just because someone is a star it doesn't make them able to impart knowledge and some people, like me, learn a little differently than others.  . Some coaches though can say something and it just makes no sense at all, the guy who partners my dances counts everything, I don't.


For this thread though, not a coaching skate but when my friend and I decided to choreograph our couples interp program for nationals with a king full theme, Jeffrey Battle decided to show up that day to work with David Wilson on a beautiful new program.  I am not often intimidated on ice and like when the current "stars" come on with us but we ended up in a corner with our silly little program. 

[jjane45]

Jeffrey Buttle decided to show up that day to work with David Wilson on a beautiful new program...

I won't be able to even stand on the ice... Probably will press my face against the glasses with hearts in my eyes       Oh wait, your rink does not have glasses nor boards lol

[SynchKat]

Ha ha, you would be on the ice with him, it was an adult session.  And he would give way to you, they respect everyone's space and right to use the ice. 

[phoenix]

My coach is famous, it took a little while to get used to it & get the stars out of my eyes. But he's an excellent coach & i have a lot of respect for him as a person too. Not every high profile skater will be a great coach, they have to have the right temperment & be able to break things down for you. But when they can, you really benefit from their own great training and expertise.

[ChristyRN]

We have an Olympic silver medallist at our rink, but I wouldn't take lessons for two reasons:  she's waaaay out of my budget, and more importantly, I wouldn't learn under her teaching style.  I'd be too frustrated.  She seems to relate better to the kids, and that's fine. 

[jjane45]

Oh my gosh, I totally forgot about the World champion at my rink @@  Had him for group lesson and switched away immediately because of his teaching style. Most adult skaters at my rink had issues, he does train very successful kid competitors.

[techskater]

jjane, his most talented student came to him with a 2A, so he's really building on a solid foundation already there.

I heard from a friend who went that some of the coaching participants in the Dorothy Hamil camp are better than others.  Those who had more of a struggle learning their elements are the better teachers.

[AgnesNitt]

I heard from a friend who went that some of the coaching participants in the Dorothy Hamil camp are better than others.  Those who had more of a struggle learning their elements are the better teachers.

That's always the way in anything.

[techskater]

Yes and no.  Usually, yes, because they are the ones who had to have it explained multiple ways in order to get it, but not ALL naturals are lacking the ability to explain.

[jjane45]

Yes and no.  Usually, yes, because they are the ones who had to have it explained multiple ways in order to get it, but not ALL naturals are lacking the ability to explain.

And the willingness to explain

[karne]

There's a six-time Australian Champion at our rink but I don't take lessons from her. She seems nice but doesn't deal with the younger/beginner skaters too well.

If I had the money, and if he did them for adults, I'd pack off to one of Mishin's summer camps. Not only do you get instruction from Mishin, but Plushenko, Gachinski and Tuktamysheva are often there helping him as well. By all accounts Plushenko attaches himself to the little kids and does very well with them. I'm not sure I'd be able to stay upright long enough to learn something from Gachinski though. 

[Dreaswi]

I'm on the bench with a shattered ankle and I just had a lesson from Wesley Campbell. It was so worth it. We worked based on video and he demonstrated what I was doing wrong. Also it was amazing to pick the brain of an elite skater in regards to the mental aspect of skating and competing.

[karne]

Phew. Now you don't even need a fortune to take coaching from Olympic champions!


http://www.kuliksskating.com/index.php

You can have a private lesson with Ilia or Katia for just $30 for 15 minutes. Seems VERY reasonable to me!

Better yet, the website says it's for all levels - tiny tots, competitive, ADULTS... 

Why are plane tickets to Cali so expensive? 

[jjane45]

I am seriously tempted too, I want Katia's smooth and feather light stroking!! Maybe kiwiskater could fit it into her schedule since she'll be at LAX soon! The rink size of 80' x 130' is really a bummer though.

On the other hand, their rate is what I think elite coaches charge in general. IIRC Frank Carroll does not charge sky high either. Higher than the average coaching rate in the area, but not twice as much.

What do famous coaches / skaters charge in your area compared to the average rate?

ETA: Frank Carrol now charges $50 for 20 minutes. I think it was lower when he was at Toyota Sports Center. I remember picking up a brochure and surprised at how reasonable the rate was.

[SynchKat]

What is he going rate for lessons nowadays? I guess it varies from place to place but a ballpark figure

[jjane45]

$35 for 30 minutes around here

[FigureSpins]

You can have a private lesson with Ilia or Katia for just $30 for 15 minutes. Seems VERY reasonable to me!

$120/hour is comparable to what most elite US coaches charge, but the rank-and-file PSA coaches charge anywhere from $60-$90/hour.  I can definitely see it for higher-level skaters because they need the extra knowledge and experience, but for beginners and low-level skaters, it's overpriced.

As Slusher once said, you don't need an Olympic medal to teach tots how to lick the ice, lol.

[Dreaswi]

The average rate for private in Nashville is 70-85 for an hour

[AgnesNitt]

Yeah, you have to know when you're ready to take a lesson with a star coach or skater to make it worth the money investment. I wasn't ready until this year.

[jjane45]

$120/hour is comparable to what most elite US coaches charge, but the rank-and-file PSA coaches charge anywhere from $60-$90/hour.  I can definitely see it for higher-level skaters because they need the extra knowledge and experience, but for beginners and low-level skaters, it's overpriced.

As Slusher once said, you don't need an Olympic medal to teach tots how to lick the ice, lol.

Ha, it's the crazy fun girl in me wants to meet Katia on ice. The ability to take a lesson from her is a bonus! I'd have to win the lottery first to take lessons from elite coaches regularly

[Query]

First of all, almost everyone I've met who teaches skating at a professional level is an incredibly good athlete. Take a look at the Bios various clubs post. It seems like everyone has won regional competitions, or made it to Nationals of one country or another, or has USFSA gold test levels in freestyle and dance, or toured or choreographed with Disney On Ice, Stars on Ice, etc. They are all so high above most of us, maybe exactly how how shouldn't be a major criteria, especially if we don't expect to win major league competitions.

As an almost new skater, I asked a club "pro liason" who would be a good ice dance coach. She was trying to recruit world class ice dancers to come and coach, so she gave me the name of one of the coaches whose services she had recruited - a Russian former Olympian by the name of Genrikh Sretenski. Some skaters and skating fans say he was among the finest male ice dancers in history. At the time three Olympic hopeful Dance teams were taking from him.

That appealed to me in part because I had happily taken kayak lessons from a world class kayaker, who was one of the best teachers in any subject I had ever met. The kayaker was equally good at teaching other competitive athletes, and klutzes like me. So I naturally assumed all world class athletes were great teachers too, for everyone.

Genrickh charged the highest rates in the area. But for a year or two I used him. I initially assumed world class athlete meant he would teach the "right" style, and taking from him would make it easy to partner with ladies. But he emphasized a highly idiosyncratic style - which I didn't recognize. So when I tried to partner with ladies in the club, I was doing all the wrong things, moving my body in opposite ways from the American norm. He did push a lot for speed and other things that were good, and I still practice a lot of his drills, but his English was imperfect, and I had a lot of trouble distinguishing what was supposed to be drill technique, and what was supposed to be good skating technique. He also always used Show, when I needed a lot of Tell. And I wasn't going to practice partnering with another male. (For a while I simultaneously took lessons from one of his competitive ladies, Caitlin Obremski, with whom I could partner.)

After realizing I wasn't getting better very fast, and was spending a lot of time [20 hours/week] and money on it, I quit with him. And yet, three of my other coaches (including Caitlin), with whom I had better luck, took from him as their coach, and were quite happy with him. So he is a great coach, and I believe he still coaches a number of great competitive skaters - just not for me.

In the end, as a non-athlete trying to do athletic things, I need a coach who is able to analyze exactly how to do things, can demonstrate well, can explain well, can sometimes move my body to the positions needed, can explain how to train, and has a detailed technical knowledge of what you need to do to make the body move well, not just the innate ability to do those things. At my skating level, that doesn't take a world class skater, it takes a world class teacher, one better adapted to my needs.

If for some reason you need a new coach, I encourage you to try out someone outstanding. He/she might work very well for you, and it can be quite inspiring. But also look at coaches that seem to be outstanding teachers.

On the other hand, switching coaches usually creates a lot of problems, as you have to get used to their teaching and skating style. You might be better off staying with your current coach.

I think a good way to experiment is to take a group lesson from someone good. Say, an ice dance or edge clinic. If you are up front with your current coach about that, it doesn't have to mean burning your bridges with your current coach.

- Just my view

[techskater]

If you have the opportunity, WATCH someone who is supposedly outstanding to determine if he/she is good for you/your skater before asking for lessons with them. 

I have heard that if the opportunity arises, take lessons or a seminar with Paul Wylie and/or Todd Eldredge as both are great teachers.