What is the minimum requirement for an arabesque?

[sampaguita]

For the ISI test, how high should the leg be? The arabesque is not one of my favorite moves -- I'm going to need to be a LOT more flexible than I am now if I'm going to get a good arabesque, but I'd like to know if I can "bypass" this move by just passing the bare minimum.

This is how my arabesque looks like, btw: http://youtu.be/kpO20ZiqXSc

Thanks a lot!

[Skittl1321]

I'm pretty sure it is the same as USFS: hip height.   

Which means you are ALMOST there.   I think you had it a few times, you need to work on the strength to maintain it.   (Also, think about curving your back like a banana, it gives a much prettier line, and an illusion of height.)

[jjane45]

Hip height is right. As skittl said, it's about strength at this point. Off ice stretching would be helpful. Some people even do it with ankle weights to simulate the weight of skates.

[sampaguita]

I'm pretty sure it is the same as USFS: hip height.   

Which means you are ALMOST there.   I think you had it a few times, you need to work on the strength to maintain it.   (Also, think about curving your back like a banana, it gives a much prettier line, and an illusion of height.)

Dang! My glutes and lower back are going to kill me! I think I did get a good arabesque position off-ice when I was still doing yoga, but then I got injured and I never knew how it would look on ice. And since I stopped yoga for skating and the gym -- I guess something's gotta give!

How about the head height? Does it have to be level with the foot?

[Kim to the Max]

I describe it like your head and leg/foot are the ends of a teeter totter. Your shoulders need to go down in order for your leg to go up. Not too far down, and make sure to keep your chin up and back arched the whole time.

[Isk8NYC]

From the ISI Handbook:

Forward Arabesque (spiral)

A forward glide must be made in the arabesque position on one foot, either straight on the flat or on either edge, for a distance equal to four times the skater's height (this refers to the compulsory part of the test only). The free leg must be extended behind the heel of the skating foot and held at least as high as the skating hip. The head should be held up and facing forward with the back arched. The arm position is optional, (knee or leg may be held). Holding the blade or the boot is considered an uncaptured maneuver.

(Online version: http://www.metroedgefsc.org/page/show/239244-freestyle-1-3 A few typos here and there.)

Think of the spiral position as a banana: your head is up and erect, your back is arched, and your free leg is up behind your head, in line.

[sampaguita]

Got it, Isk8NYC! Thanks for the link!

[slcbelle]

And the free leg should be perfectly straight with the toe pointed.  I've been focusing on off-ice stretching of my hamstrings (and everything else!) and practicing the spiral position and improving my balance by lifting the free leg with my knee straight and toes pointed in bare feet many times a day. At first, I was wobbly on ice and dry land.  Now, after more than a week of doing it over and over at home, I'm seeing an improvement on ice.  Have you tried practicing at home?

[Doubletoe]

Based on your video, it looks like the balance is probably more of an issue than your flexibility.  
To practice the position, stand on the ice facing the boards, grab the boards and pull yourself back away from the boards while pushing your skating foot forward, squeezing your shoulder blades together, lifting your chin, pressing your belly button down toward the ice, and raising your free leg behind you and turning it out.  That will put your skating foot in front of your hips at this angle \ instead of directly under your hips at this angle |.  The effect is that it pushes your hips down, gets your weight away from your toepick and allows you to lift your free leg above hip level without pitching forward and tripping.   Even when you are out on the open ice with nothing to hold onto, it should feel exactly the same, like you are holding onto something and pulling back from it.

[sampaguita]

Based on your video, it looks like the balance is probably more of an issue than your flexibility.  
To practice the position, stand on the ice facing the boards, grab the boards and pull yourself back away from the boards while pushing your skating foot forward, squeezing your shoulder blades together, lifting your chin, pressing your belly button down toward the ice, and raising your free leg behind you and turning it out.  That will put your skating foot in front of your hips at this angle \ instead of directly under your hips at this angle |.  The effect is that it pushes your hips down, gets your weight away from your toepick and allows you to lift your free leg above hip level without pitching forward and tripping.   Even when you are out on the open ice with nothing to hold onto, it should feel exactly the same, like you are holding onto something and pulling back from it.

Unfortunately I am pretty sure it is flexibility. I cannot attain the free leg height off-ice. My calf muscles and hamstrings are very tight, and my lower back is not flexible enough to do the arch.

I remember another thread about this | vs \ skating leg position for the spiral and how it affects balance. Were you one of the posters there? I'll keep the "\" position in mind once I am able to do the position off-ice. Thanks!

[jjane45]

Unfortunately I am pretty sure it is flexibility. I cannot attain the free leg height off-ice. My calf muscles and hamstrings are very tight, and my lower back is not flexible enough to do the arch.

I remember another thread about this | vs \ skating leg position for the spiral and how it affects balance. Were you one of the posters there? I'll keep the "\" position in mind once I am able to do the position off-ice. Thanks!

I remember watching your video, and balance was the first thing that came to my mind too. I probably even commented the free leg height was ok.

Just keep stretching them and try standing on one leg more often, you'll get there!

[Skate@Delaware]

Unfortunately I am pretty sure it is flexibility. I cannot attain the free leg height off-ice. My calf muscles and hamstrings are very tight, and my lower back is not flexible enough to do the arch.

I remember another thread about this | vs \ skating leg position for the spiral and how it affects balance. Were you one of the posters there? I'll keep the "\" position in mind once I am able to do the position off-ice. Thanks!

If you are having a hard time holding your leg up, then it's a strength issue.  You can practice it at home, holding the leg up (preferably in front of a mirror) and set a timer. Try to do it multiple times for several seconds with each leg.  Of course, you'd want to warm up before, and stretch after.  My lower back doesn't stretch/arch at all so I also have a time with this.

[Doubletoe]

Unfortunately I am pretty sure it is flexibility. I cannot attain the free leg height off-ice. My calf muscles and hamstrings are very tight, and my lower back is not flexible enough to do the arch.

I remember another thread about this | vs \ skating leg position for the spiral and how it affects balance. Were you one of the posters there? I'll keep the "\" position in mind once I am able to do the position off-ice. Thanks!

Yes, that was me.   If your calves and hamstrings are really tight, this will be good motivation to start stretching them regularly.  That will help prevent knee injuries, too.  I've posted hamstring stretches on this site so won't bother re-posting, but the most important thing to remember is to use correct form and hold each position--even if you're only partway down-- for a full 30 seconds as long as you can feel the stretch.
I don't have any back bend either, but I've developed strong upper glutes from doing spirals, and that's what you really need in order to lift that leg up with the heavy boot at the end of it.  I agree that doing leg lifts off ice with your skates on is a great exercise for this (and then do your hamstring stretches afterward).

[FigureSpins]

One of my skating students had a dramatic improvement in her spirals after I suggested she ask her ballet instructor for some barre exercises.  The ballet teacher had her do backward leg kicks after a good warmup.  On each kick, she had to stretch higher and then hold the third one for 20 seconds. 

I think it really limbered her up and strengthened her leg, especially since she couldn't kick out to the side the way she did on entering her spiral.  I don't think the kicks did any harm (we always say "don't bounce" during stretches) and the hold really helped her lock the free hip in the right front-to-back split position.  She went from having the free foot always below the hip and out to the side to passing Pre-Preliminary with compliments from the judges.

The exercise was called "Grande Battlement Back" - here's a video:

http://www.howcast.com/videos/487730-Ballet-Dancing-How-to-Do-a-Grand-Battement

Give it a try for a few weeks and see if it helps you.  You don't need a barre - a high counter or stool will work fine.

[jjane45]

The ballet teacher had her do backward leg kicks after a good warmup.  On each kick, she had to stretch higher and then hold the third one for 20 seconds.  

The video froze on me, but it sounds similar to what I recently did with dance coach: kick back straight and bring it forward high near belly button. Nine consecutive kicks then hold in spiral position for 10 seconds. Repeat.

The kicks involve a bit of bouncing so don't push it too hard or you risk injuring the lower back. But I totally felt kicking higher toward the end.

[slcbelle]

Unfortunately I am pretty sure it is flexibility.

I just bought this book, Full Body Flexibility, and it's awesome.  I've been stretching with it every day for 2 weeks and I am definitely more limber and have less aching in my ligaments and tendons.  I bought if for the Kindle but I open it on my laptop so I can see the images easily and follow along.  Check it out: http://www.amazon.com/Full-Body-Flexibility-Edition-Jay-Blahnik/dp/0736090363/ref=pd_sim_b_2

As I said, I practice the spiral stance at home.  I also practice holding myself in the stroking position (extending and pointing the free leg, squeezing my glutes, putting my shoulders back, arms to the side, "girls" on the table) many times a day to strengthen my butt, back, and legs so I can hold it on ice. 

[sampaguita]

Thanks for the video! I tried the grande battlement after watching it, and it's manageable, with a proper warm up. It's enjoyable too.   I also found that holding the door knob is enough. Am I right that this is more of a strengthening exercise for the glutes?

The exercise was called "Grande Battlement Back" - here's a video:

http://www.howcast.com/videos/487730-Ballet-Dancing-How-to-Do-a-Grand-Battement

Give it a try for a few weeks and see if it helps you.  You don't need a barre - a high counter or stool will work fine.

[sampaguita]

Just reread the arabesque requirement -- there is no mention of whether the skating leg is straight or not. Does that mean that a bent skating leg is okay? That might help me raise the free leg higher.

[techskater]

That will not help you at the hip level (knee to hip)

[jjane45]

Does that mean that a bent skating leg is okay?

Please do not bend that skating knee for spirals. It's a real eyesore...

[sarahspins]

Please do not bend that skating knee for spirals. It's a real eyesore...

Not only that but you put yourself in a position where you are at an increased risk of hitting your toepick and slamming down hard on your kneecap - a straight leg is essential for the correct skating position for a forward spiral with the hips pushed back.  If your hamstrings are so tight that you can't get into the position without bending your skating knee, then you really need to work off-ice on stretching your legs and holding those positions.  Work on them on-ice at the boards (facing the boards, use them for balance, you're not skating) until you are confident that you can do it moving.  I think it's more important to focus on the correct skating leg and hip position than to worry about how high (or not high) the skating leg is.  The strength to get your leg up higher will come in time, but breaking a bad habit later will take MUCH more effort than learning it correctly now.

[Doubletoe]

Ditto what sarahspins just said.

[slcbelle]

About the straight skating leg, it's funny...I'm limber enough to do it but whenever I straighten my leg, I feel like I might topple forward.  My coach said I need to think of really being far back in the boot.  I'll try a little harder today.  :-)

[techskater]

SLC, try and feel as if the top back of your boot is digging into your leg.  Not a pleasant visual/feeling, but it might help

[jjane45]

About the straight skating leg, it's funny...I'm limber enough to do it but whenever I straighten my leg, I feel like I might topple forward.  My coach said I need to think of really being far back in the boot.  I'll try a little harder today.  :-)

That's why forward spiral is scarier than the back spiral (but going backward with toe picks above kids' head is scary on another level).

As Doubletoe pointed out, the skating leg is not perpendicular to the ice, it's forming an angle.





Put as much weight on the back of the skating foot as possible... Easier said than done, I know