Saw Skittl's comment about 8 step mohawk being a "concussion move", coincidentally I just had a conversation with group coach about which elements are guilty of causing more falls on the head. He observed that one foot spin is the number one culprit (raising my hand), then beginning 3-turns and mohawks. Adults also tend to fall on their head more on back outside 3 turns compared to kids. I found his observations interesting and have the following questions:
What do you observe as the top "concussion moves", in freestyle elements or specific steps in dance / MITF, other than randomly tripping over toepicks?
Does the risk of head injury increase as skaters move up in levels while developing better skating skills? (half jumps vs. triple jumps, two foot spin vs. flying camels)
What do you see as the top impact areas in the worst head injuries, other than the back of the head? (Yeah I am considering to put more padding back into my hat, lol)
I have never (ever) hit my head skating.. and I've had plenty of falls, and since I still struggle with back 3's I've even had some recently (I could do them as a kid but they terrify me now) but usually my falls are of the "slip off the back of my blade and land on my butt" variety. I think having good core strength helps - I tend to "ball up" when I fall, and I just let it happen, so I'm not usually flailing - I think it's the flailing (often in an attempt not to fall) that causes more problems than the fall itself would have
I have gotten fairly impressive hematomas on my upper thigh/hip area from falling on doubles (I didn't always use padding - I probably should have relied on it more than I did), and then there was that one time I dislocated my knee trying to "save" an axel landing (it was over-rotated) during a program run through - it was a scenario that wouldn't have happened if I hadn't been under pressure to "get through" the whole program without bailing/falling on jumps (I was in a lesson when it happened). Normally I would have just fallen and it wouldn't have been a big deal.
I haven't seen many head injuries, and in fact when I worked at the rink, the only major head injury we had in the 18 months or so I worked there was with an employee, who ended up with a fairly large gash on his temple area after colliding with another skater. He was not working at the time it happened though, just skating with family for fun.
Only time I've hit my head was when I was going to step forwards from back crossovers into a spiral. I took my own feet out as I uncrossed them and the momentum was straight backwards. Most of my falls tend to be onto the hips and knees as normally I'm rotating on a turn as I go down.
Other than online folks, or stories at the rink, I've only seen one head injury. It was an ABSOLUTE beginner who toepicked over his rental skates, and fell face first into the ice (he clearly had no "catch myself and break my wrists instinct"...), I think this was his first time on the ice. He smashed the top of his forehead into the ice and wash GUSHING blood. I don't know the severity of it (foreheads tend to bleed A LOT regardless of severity, just because there is a lot of blood there), but he did have a concussion. He left in an ambulance, and returned the next week to take classes, where the skate director told him she would give him a full refund and the next set of classes free, but she wouldn't allow him back on the ice for 4-weeks after a concussion. I think this, along with another woman who sued over a broken wrist, is what killed our adult LTS. The manager now has to approve adults to enter LTS, he thinks they are too much of a liability.
I think head injuries are rare, and if you can only wear one pad, I'd pick a hip one. I worry greatly about slamming my head though because I don't fall well, every fall is a bad fall, because it only happens about once or twice a year. I also have some spinal cord issues, so while I probably shouldn't worry more than anyone else about ice skating, I do.
I've seen a couple of head injuries, one on a very low level learn to skate class (an adult, not sure what happened but probably a toepick/general slip fall). The other one was a kid figure skater doing a worm on the ice for a routine, lifted her head too high and kicked herself in the back of the head with her blade, ouch! And finally, an adult skater on barrell rolls. I've not hurt my head (touch wood!) on barrell rolls, but had a couple of big falls on them
I've had two head-bangers.
The first happened when I was still skating. I was literally doing NOTHING - just standing on the ice, chatting. I turned around to skate off and whoop! Feet went out from under me and down I went backwards, head-first. I was at Fritz Dietl's in Westwood, NJ, almost an hour away from home, but I didn't lose consciousness or get sick. A friend took care of me for an hour or two, then followed me all the way home to make sure I got there safely. (He was my best skating buddy)
The second time was while I was teaching mohawks. Another coach demonstrated FI mohawks with the free foot coming down BEHIND the skating foot. I tried to follow her demonstration model and I stepped on my own blade and flipped backwards. The fall really hurt - I had whiplash for almost two weeks and a lump on my head that was HUGE, even with icing it. The scan showed a mild concussion, so I was off the ice for a week or two, except for teaching.
Head injuries I've seen:
. synchro skater thrown from a too-small circle that was moving way too fast for her = lump, whiplash and concussion.
. singles skater about to take the ice for a competition went down and slammed into the boards. Bad gash plus concussion.
. chin split from forward spiral face-plant.
. chin split from being pushed by another skater from behind unexpectedly.
. forehead split/concussion at hairline from slow collision with another skater.
(Cut may have been from the ice or the other person's blade. They ended up tangled.)
my best friend is a coach and when I was learning barrell rolls (closed mohawk, cross in front) she nicely told me she'd fallen twice in one week while teaching them, because she stepped on the back of her blade!
QuoteWhat do you observe as the top "concussion moves", in freestyle elements or specific steps in dance / MITF, other than randomly tripping over toepicks?
Two-foot turns and backward cross-steps/rolls. I think spins produce more dangerous falls than jumps - most people just sit down or whop body-first onto the ice after a bad jump. Knees also take more of a beating on jump falls.
QuoteDoes the risk of head injury increase as skaters move up in levels while developing better skating skills? (half jumps vs. triple jumps, two foot spin vs. flying camels)
In real life, no one goes from doing two-foot spins to a flying camel very quickly, but progressing from one-foot spins to a camel can produce a face-plant, especially if the skater is "teaching themselves." If you don't understand the progression in learning the higher-level skills, you're more likely to be injured.
QuoteWhat do you see as the top impact areas in the worst head injuries, other than the back of the head? (Yeah I am considering to put more padding back into my hat, lol)
Facial areas have less fat to cushion a blow, therefore, the chin, cheek and forehead have little natural protection from bumps and bangs. That's why injuries in those areas split and bleed so profusely. I don't know how you could protect those areas unless you were to wear a face cage on a helmet. Those are mostly face-first falls.
Someone on the old board once suggested that all skate guards should have RFID (anti-theft) tags to warn skaters to remove their guards before stepping on the ice. (Been there, done that, grazed my chinny-chin-chin.) I thought it was a good idea, but I'm not sure how you'd implement it in real life.
Quote from: FigureSpins on September 22, 2011, 08:30:46 AM
Someone on the old board once suggested that all skate guards should have RFID (anti-theft) tags to warn skaters to remove their guards before stepping on the ice. (Been there, done that, grazed my chinny-chin-chin.) I thought it was a good idea, but I'm not sure how you'd implement it in real life.
One of the "skate moms" (her kid is in basic 7, it is just so ridiculous at this level) gave me a death glare on Tuesday. Her son was fooling around near the ice, as usual, and went to get onto the ice early (a no-no at LTS). I usually keep my mouth shut and figure the skate director needs to handle that, but in this case, he had his guards on. I yelled "he has guards on! Don't let him on the ice!" and she looked at me and said "don't tell me what to do with my son!" and then he ran out onto the ice and SPLAT. Whew! Glad no one was bossing her around.
Quote from: Skittl1321 on September 22, 2011, 08:47:18 AM
One of the "skate moms" (her kid is in basic 7, it is just so ridiculous at this level) gave me a death glare on Tuesday. Her son was fooling around near the ice, as usual, and went to get onto the ice early (a no-no at LTS). I usually keep my mouth shut and figure the skate director needs to handle that, but in this case, he had his guards on. I yelled "he has guards on! Don't let him on the ice!" and she looked at me and said "don't tell me what to do with my son!" and then he ran out onto the ice and SPLAT. Whew! Glad no one was bossing her around.
Well, at least you tried to save him from the fall. She owes you thanks and an apology, but you won't get either.
"Thank you, Skittl1321, for trying to keep the kid from getting hurt. I'm sorry that his mother was so focused on her ego that she didn't recognize that you were speaking out of concern for her son."
The only time I can remember ever hitting my head (knock on wood) was early in my spinning days. Caught a rut mid-spin and crashed before I could even process what was happening. It wasn't a bad hit, just a minor bump.
Most of my jump falls are on my side or tush....both of which have lots of, er, "natural padding". When I was initially learning the flip jump, I would underrotate that and fall directly on my knee caps...a LOT. Maybe that's why it's my best jump now...self-preservation instinct (LOL). My worst falls have been on MITF or various elements from them...toepick on spirals, whiplash from back cross strokes, and the infamous 8 step broken wrist. For that matter, I've taught a lot of tots and Basic 1-2 and the only time I've ever had a kid hit their head in class, was when one of our teen helpers for tot 1 let go of a kid at the wrong time and basically dropped him on his head. :( Knees are what usually take the worst beating with the little ones I've seen.
ETA, daughter skated through Intermediate and her worst fall was when her coach was trying to teach her an alternate axel entry. I think it was from a counter. She got hung up on the counter and went airborne horizontally and landed directly on her face...WHILE wearing glasses, no less. Miraculously the glasses remained in one piece and only a small cut above her eyebrow, but she had the mother of all black eyes. As soon as the bruising cleared up we were in the eye doctor's office getting her fitted for contacts...that was THE END of glasses on the ice for her.
I've hit my head twice, but only once was on the ice: I had a really awkward flip off the landing edge on a double sal that was FAR too close to the boards, and hit the boards with the side of my head. I had to take a couple of weeks off the ice (should have been more as spinning gave me headaches for another couple of weeks afterwards, but concussions just weren't taken seriously at all then...) After that I made sure I was way far from the boards when jumping.
The other sort-of skating-related head bump was when my coach slipped on a patch of ice in the parking lot into the car door and slammed it into my head (I was just getting my bag out of the backseat) - totally freak accident, but I ended up with a giant Flinstones-style bump next to my ear. Attractive!
We had a kid at my current rink that lost an edge during power stroking and hit her head on the ice and blackout, but other than that, I haven't really seen too many concussions, mostly broken bones, bad sprains and split chins.
I've hit my head 3 three times. First time, I was in Adult LTS and coach showed us how to do a shoot-the-duck. I am a very cautious skater, and normally would have watched everyone else in the class first before trying the move. I have no idea what got into me, but I volunteered to try first. The coach did not tell us to bend/extend our arms forward on the move - she just demonstrated the move and asked us to try 1x1. So I just went into shoot-the-duck position with actual speed (for me), did not bend/extend my arms, and promptly slipped off the back of my blade and landed on my head. I felt very sick and shaky afterwards - didn't think about concussion possibility and husband was traveling so I drove myself home. I was ok - but it was a very long time before I tried a shoot-the-duck again.
Second time I was doing nothing. I had the ice to myself, and I was standing on the ice thinking about what to practice next. Somehow I hit a condensation bump on the ice (I must have made some backward motion on the ice) and toppled over backward and landed on my head like a tree falling down. I had a scrunchy and ponytail but my hair is really fine and thin so not a lot of padding. I got off the ice and was crying because it hurt so much and because I was very shaken/scared. Rink manager got me some ice and said I should go home but I had taken vacation to skate and was practicing for a Christmas show program so I got back on ice and did small things.
Third time I was doing a scratch spin and I guess I got my weight too far back on the blade and once again, landed on my head.
I'm like Skittl - I rarely fall but my falls are memorable. Had a toepick accident first time I wore my new pretty white skates (used but new to me) after my first two weeks in Adult LTS. I was just skating forward (all I knew how to do at the time) and I toepicked and landed full weight on my knee. Got up, skated over to the boards telling a friend I was ok - then I fainted from the pain. Came to in the hockey box with all these people standing over me. I was so embarrassed. I made myself get back out on the ice and skate - I knew if I went home immediately that I'd never come back.
My other spectacular fall came when I was learning waltz jump - falling leaf - toe loop. Practicing after LTS. I missed the toepick on the landing of the falling leaf, blade slipped out from under me and I landed on my hip and elbow. Don't know how I didn't slam my head into the ice, too. I didn't try a falling leaf again until just a few weeks ago (so a few years later!), and only because my coach encouraged me to try. It's the ugliest falling leaf EVER but at least I am trying. I think I understand what I did wrong in LTS to cause the fall/miss the toepick. My coach was actually scared when she saw what I was doing and showed me why it was wrong and I finally understood. I wasn't jumping off the landing edge of the waltz jump so my weight transfer wasn't right to let me land the falling leaf on the toepick. I make everything so much harder than I should!
The move I have seen most adults hit their head on is the sit spin. Two of the adults I saw do that never came back to the ice. (And they had skated as kids - they were maybe over-confident in their abilities after being off ice for years?) I can't get my sit spin low enough and I think I am remembering these ladies slamming their heads into the ice. I have a tendency to rock back on my blade in my sit spin as it is so I think I won't let myself go any lower. Muscle-wise, I should be able to go lower. I might buy an Ice Halo for my sit spin and for Silver moves (working on those now, evil evil 3-turn patterns! I probably don't know enough to be scared of 8-step because it doesn't scare me.)
Not every head bump ends up in a concussion, however, repetitive strikes to the head, especially within a short span of time are accumulative and account for more Traumatic Brain Injuries (TBI) and are more dangerous than a one-time concussion. You don't necessarily "black out" with a concussion but there are other symptoms.
FYI: http://www.traumaticbraininjury.com/ (http://www.traumaticbraininjury.com/) for more information.
A concussion IS a TBI. I think it is important for people to understand that, especially since they are often disucssed in sports as a throw-away injury "just shake out the cobwebs".
But yes, repeated strikes to the head, even without a concussion, can be more dangerous than a single concussion. Multiple concussions in a short time period, however, can put you in a "second strike syndrome" which doesn't happen enough to have great research on it, but can cause death.
Also, it's important to realize that you can get a concussion without actually hitting your head on anything.. because it's not about what is happening to your skull, but your brain.
I've had several concussions. One from softball, one from a car accident, and at least two on the ice. The first one was right after I started skating. I was standing in the goal crease, then looking at the silver metallic ceiling. Had no idea what happened. I literally saw stars and the back of my head swelled like Wile E Coyote's after the anvil landed on his head. And, like Live2k8, I got back on the ice because I knew if I didn't, I never would again. Luckily, my then-husband had come to the rink with DD and me, so he drove me home. I wasn't myself for several days.
Dd has one of those - "I was just standing and ended up flat on my back" yesterday! She has fallen and hit her head several times including hitting her upper teeth on the ice (spiral/face plant) once.
I've had 2 concussions and both from dance. The first was when I was a teen practicing an OD with my brother and he fell ion my head. I couldn't figure out why everyone was so concerned about me because I didn't remember the point of impact. Second was as an adult, I caught someone's leg and landed on my chin. I few minutes later I had no periphrial (sp?) vision.
We did have a lady at the rink fall and hit her head doing the Blues choctaw with no speed. This was back in the spring and she's just getting back on the ice but is still dizzy.
Head injuries are so common on the ice and always seem to happen when you least expect.
Back threes have a reputation locally as a head banger for adult learners. I knew a guy who banged his head 3 times and still wouldn't wear a helmet. On the other hand, I know a guy who banged his head once and got a helmet next day.
Lucky for me I have only hit my head once. I was about 14 and was at a mid day public session. A friend of mine fell and I went to spray him with snow via hockey stop. I caught a rut and fell. I whacked my head by the temple pretty hard but I don't think it was a concussion. Took an aspirin right then and there and managed no headache. Only a slight bump and bruise. I count my lucky stars on that one.
I've only hit my head once (in 7 years old skating, knock on wood!). It was when I was prepping for Juv MIF and working on 8-step mohawks - yup, stepped on my blade and went down. Made a loud enough noise that the entire freestyle session paused for a moment to check on me. Two days off the ice and I was ok - mostly I was mad my coach wouldn't let me have my lesson 30 minutes after I hit my head.
8-step is my nemesis move, I broke my arm on it a year before the head injury. I did pass the test and I am comfortable doing the move now but it did take some time.
Oy! When I was first starting out on forward power pulls. I try to improve my posture (ie, not stick my butt out) and what do I do? WHACK on the back of the head. Not a concussion but painful.
Years ago I was trying an inside 3-turn and managed to pitch forward and bang my forehead. Got a nice goose egg. That scared me off of inside 3s for a good long while.
I saw this article in the newspaper today:
http://www.katc.com/news/study-old-flu-drug-speeds-brain-injury-recovery/
Apparently, the powers that be are trying to find treatments to speed recovery from concussions and brain injuries.
This thread is terrifying me. :o
I'm seriously considering getting an Ice Halo. I saw an older lady wearing one in Nashville when we got my skates sharpened, and it doesn't look that bad from a distance. Of course, it matched her hair color, which would be impossible for me. And up close . . . even my husband said it looked "dorky". But if it would save me from having to go to the hospital with a head injury, then I'd consider it. I'm sure the other skaters at my rink would smirk, but so what? I have health issues and anxiety issues and if would help either, then maybe it would be a good idea.
The only concussion I've had came from coaching hockey and getting hit under the chin with a kid's helmeted head. (And possibly some minor concussions from walloping myself in the head with car doors and hatchbacks, but let's not talk about that right now.)
One of my adult students fell trying to either skate backwards or do a 2 foot turn and concussed herself. She wears a helmet now (luckily, since she fell and hit her head again yesterday. Ouch.)
I'm in a ski helmet 3-5 days a week so, now that I'm taking up skating again, I can't imagine doing so without head protection. I know the chance of hitting my head is remote but a brain or skull injury can be life changing and just isn't worth the risk to me. So, I bought the Ribcap Jackson:
(http://www.ribcap.ch/media/collection/ribcap_jackson_uebersicht.jpg)
http://www.ribcap.ch/en/online-shop/
It's super cute on. Like a riding helmet but soft and warm.
This is me wearing mine:
http://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/423250_10150812420959782_617574781_12586899_608605131_n.jpg (http://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/423250_10150812420959782_617574781_12586899_608605131_n.jpg)
Better dorky than brain damaged.
I had 3 concussions on the ice last year (very unlucky!). 2 of them happened the exact same way which was during wind-up for a spin, and the 3rd I tangled my blades in a mohawk. :S
For 2 wind-up ones, I was skating on the right back inside edge, about to step/push into a spin, when I caught the tail of my blade in a divot in the ice and my feet came flying up in the air from underneath me and I landed smack on the back of my head - major ouch!! :(
I can now honestly say after the other Friday that I've had a concussion from skating.
But it's a little embarassing to admit I tripped on my toepick doing fowards crossovers.
I'll disclose my identity by sharing this story, since I think every adult skater in Virginia and possibly DC and Maryland has heard it already, but oh well.
I fell last year on a left outside 3-turn entrance to a flip jump. I went down so hard I couldn't catch myself, and I smacked the left side of my forehead and my nose on the ice. Nose was bruised. My forehead took 17 stitches from a facial plastic surgeon.
No concussion, though. I was excited because I'd never gotten stitches before. I was back on the ice three days later and attempted flips again during that session. (Possibly a symptom for the Adult Onset Skating Syndrome thead.) The scar has faded to a very thin line.
Both my coach and I felt the fall was a freak accident. I'd been doing 3-turns for probably three years, and I'd never come close to hitting my head on a fall before. There's another adult skater at my rink who fell and hit his head a couple of months before I did, and a little boy who had just started taking skating lessons fell last fall. The adult skater took several stitches, and I think the little boy had his cut glued.
My other "concussion move" is a slip. I fell over backwards on one last fall and got whiplash. That was three days of rest and ice and heat and was actually much more unpleasant and painful than the head wound.
I've never had an actual concussion that I know of.
Yowza! That scares me. Sorry to hear about your injuries Jennymp, karne, and VAsk8ter. That's why I just can't imagine skating without head protection.
My first lesson after returning to the ice this year from a 32 year hiatus involved showing my coach what I did (and didn't know) how to do.
I knew I got dizzy spinning and had not regained control from when I was younger .. centering ... bad combination. I was doing a simple scratch spin
and got too far back on my blade and down I went. It felt as though I blacked out because I didn't even brace the fall. I hit the back of my head at the base
of my skull right where my PLASTIC CLAW CLIP was holding my hair up. I was lucky those little teeth didn't puncture my head. It broke into a zillion pieces. I sat there
for what seemed like an eternity... 5 minutes before I got up. I am sure I suffered a slight concussion as I was getting pretty queasy, but no blood... at least none that
I found.
Needless to say, the first thing my coach said to me after "Are you ok?" was NEVER wear hair clips skating!!!
I had a concussion from being thrown from a horse refusing a jump. I hit the ground so hard it cracked open the helmet. I ended up in the emergency room being evaluated for head trauma. But, basically, I walked away from it.
Quote from: AgnesNitt on March 05, 2012, 07:32:57 PM
I had a concussion from being thrown from a horse refusing a jump. I hit the ground so hard it cracked open the helmet. I ended up in the emergency room being evaluated for head trauma. But, basically, I walked away from it.
That's why I sold my horse in the spring ... sniff sniff
Ribcap...gooooooooood.
The only time I ever hit my head (my face actually!) was when I leaned sideways going into a spin. I hit so hard it echoed in the rink and everyone thought I broke my cheekbone (I didn't).
Concern over head injuries kept me in long hair for many years. I wound it around and clipped up in back, which provided a very nice cushion, which was tested more than once. Since I lost my hair to chemo, and gotten it back again, I'm really enjoying the ease of short hair, and trying not to worry about losing that natural cushion. I like the look of the Ribcap, but I think it would be too hot for me.
Yesterday in class we learned a girl at our rink suffered severe concussion from jump collision. Hospitalized, in and out of coma... Really really sad it happened to her, it is a dangerous sport and skaters deserve good head protection!
My face made direct contact with the ice twice since I last posted in this thread... One fluke fall from skating backwards in a MITF pattern, blades hit the boards and I went flying face down, cheek swollen right away and bruised for a week. Another was... no surprise, 8 step mohawk! Fell over something going CCW and left cheek scraped the ice very very lightly...
My first attempt at back cross strokes landed me on the back of my head and in the ER for a few stitches, but fortunately no concussion. Wish the instructor had told me to keep deep ankle bend and lean a little to the skating side and NOT back!
I also hit my head once on a double loop attempt before I really knew what I was doing (but no stitches or concussion). Chest-over-knee-over-toes on the takeoff edge has been my loop mantra ever since.
I hit my chin on the ice and had to get 4 stitches just from stepping onto a LFO edge from a RBI crossover edge. Note to self: If you bend deeply and keep your feet apart, you will not have the clink of death!
I agree that the 8-step mohawk sequence can be dangerous. I never hit my head on it, but I did catch the heel of my blade twice when I forgot to point my toes as I placed my foot down on the backward step of the mohawk. I was so smart that I did this twice in the same week! I fell on the same hip and it was the biggest, ugliest, bumpiest bruise I'd ever gotten.
Quote from: jjane45 on September 24, 2012, 11:10:07 PM
Yesterday in class we learned a girl at our rink suffered severe concussion from jump collision. Hospitalized, in and out of coma... Really really sad it happened to her, it is a dangerous sport and skaters deserve good head protection!
I know the circumstances surrounding one of these and I would say coach's fault in that case
Our rink just started carrying the Ice Halo. Last spring one of the skaters - a very good skater who is, well, not young - fell with her coach on a dance and cracked her head. She was in the hospital for weeks and it was really touch and go for a while.
One of our skaters who is a judge started wearing the Ice Halo last year and I thought it was pretty cool. Now that the rink is selling them there are at least 10 people wearing them and I just got one last weekend. It feels fine, looks stylin' and really - it is your head after all and you have to protect it!!!
Quote from: techskater on September 25, 2012, 06:52:48 PM
I know the circumstances surrounding one of these and I would say coach's fault in that case
Can you tell us the circumstances while being circumspect? As a teaching moment for the rest of us?
I haven't looked at this myself yet, but icoachskating has an article about concussions:
http://www.icoachskating.com/site.php/spgs/read/concussion_testing2
In August I am pretty sure I had a mild concussion (no, I didn't go to the doctor, but saw a friend who is an EMT/health care professional that evening). I was doing the back outside double 3, to back inside rocker/rocker power pulls from Senior Moves. I went to do the rocker/rocker and must have been too far back on my blade and my feet flew out from under me and suddenly I was falling. My head hit the ice twice and apparently sounded like a bowling ball. The other coaches weren't going to let me stand up, but when you are laying on the ice in a tank top, it gets kinda' cold, so I wanted my jacket. I felt really bad for Coach #2 who was giving me a lesson at the time. She was pretty worried (for good reason). I went over to a friend's house to sit (since I live alone, I thought it would be better to go there than go home...if I didn't go there, I would have gone to Coach #1's house who lives just around the corner from me). Coach #2 said that if I wasn't going to go to a friend's house, she would have been coming home with me to make sure I was okay.
Quote from: AgnesNitt on September 25, 2012, 07:58:31 PM
Can you tell us the circumstances while being circumspect? As a teaching moment for the rest of us?
New skater at the rink (Prejuvenile level) in lesson doing back crossovers into double Sal at coach's direction while Senior lady was zooming down the ice into 3Lo-2T in her program (music running). She was leaving the ice for the 3Lo (so in a blind spot) when the PJ kid smacked right into her (while doing back crossovers) and both crashed to the ice. Coach didn't say anything (no look out, nothing) as coach was distracted chit chatting while PJ skater was setting up the 2S and neglected to tell skater who's music it was or who to be watching for/pattern to avoid (and Senior lady is also said coach's student, so coach would know). PJ ended up getting air lifted to children's memorial hospital with head trauma and a busted ear drum. Senior lady had a couple cuts and scrapes and a couple days of "the spooks" with people in a 10 foot radius...
I hope people are learning a precious lesson from the accident. Also we need a sash for skater in program that actually is at the boards for freestyle sessions. I've been bringing my own for running programs, somehow the rink's disappears very fast.
Don't have one at my rink. ???
Our rink recently got a set of these vests from ikea (http://www.ikea.com/us/en/catalog/products/50200916/) instead of using sashes (they come in really little kid sizes too for a dollar less)... they work great, no confusion over who's music is playing and they are definitely very visible. When they first arrived at the rink earlier this summer there were some negative comments from some of the kids and parents because they claimed these were "ugly" and "uncomfortable" (they're not unless you grab one that is way too big or way too small), but since they worked so well everyone has stopped complaining.
Quote from: AgnesNitt on September 25, 2012, 07:58:31 PM
Can you tell us the circumstances while being circumspect? As a teaching moment for the rest of us?
Not on how it happened, but two sources mentioned direct contact of head and blades as the consequence of the fall... :sad:
I was skating at a different rink one time on a public session. I was weak enough that I spent most of the time doing laps and finding a spot to practice individual skills--some on the goalie crease. I was coming around the endzone toward the sal corner (had never even heard the term at the time) trying to avoid a group of boys standing in the endzone and this upper level skater came flying into the circle. She had enough momentum when she hit me that it left a huge bruise on my upper arm and it hurt to move it for a long time. She gave me the evil eye for being there. Remember, this was a public session--and there were signs that said "no jumping or spinning"
I probably should have been more aware of her, but I was still a beginner, and even if I had seen her coming, would have not been able to get out of her way.
ChristyRN, that's ridiculous! I would have complained to management.
Management would have done nothing. It's always been that way at this rink--it's why I rarely skate there though I love one of the coaches. Her family spent a lot more money there than I did at that point, so I would have been the one at fault. I just chalked it up to live and learn and avoided her (and her sister) after that.
Quote from: jjane45 on September 28, 2012, 03:39:58 PM
Not on how it happened, but two sources mentioned direct contact of head and blades as the consequence of the fall... :sad:
Heard the girl did fracture her skull but has recovered extremely well. VERY HAPPY for her. It's great to be young!
Didn't hit my head, but I did miss my toe pick on a split jump and landed on my facial cheek. Hairline fracture of my cheek, bit through my bottom lip, sprained my wrist and got a black eye. Then had to drive home from the rink! I used ALL the lanes on the street driving home. Happily, it was Black Friday and 9:00 in the morning so either everyone was home asleep or heading home on the highways from the stores.
Quote from: techskater on September 26, 2012, 07:58:45 PM
Coach didn't say anything (no look out, nothing) as coach was distracted chit chatting while PJ skater was setting up the 2S and neglected to tell skater who's music it was or who to be watching for/pattern to avoid (and Senior lady is also said coach's student, so coach would know).
If that was my coach, either student, I would quit her faster than a speeding bullet.
My coaches always have laser eyes on me.
Quote from: AgnesNitt on October 05, 2012, 09:25:32 PM
If that was my coach, either student, I would quit her faster than a speeding bullet.
My coaches always have laser eyes on me.
Sometimes it's a distraction out of the coach's control, but I'd quit too if during private lessons I repeatedly fail to hold the coach's attention.
I asked this before but would ask again: other than the back of the head, what do you think is the most likely impact area of a bad fall on the head?
Quote from: jjane45 on October 05, 2012, 09:35:56 PM
I asked this before but would ask again: other than the back of the head, what do you think is the most likely impact area of a bad fall on the head?
Jaw.
Quote from: jjane45 on October 05, 2012, 09:35:56 PM
I asked this before but would ask again: other than the back of the head, what do you think is the most likely impact area of a bad fall on the head?
I think it's the cheekbone, to be honest. I've seen at least 4 in the last two weeks. The kids get bumps and scrapes, but fortunately, no split skin like from a jaw or chin. However, they're definitely in pain, complain of headaches for days afterward and it takes longer to heal. Parents are less likely to seek medical advice because there's little to no blood.
I think the chin/jaw is more terrifying because it usually results in bleeding and stitches. Everyone runs for towels, bandages and ice. There's no real "cushion" in that area of the face, so the skin usually splits open and bleeds a lot, but it heals very quickly and with few lingering effects other than a scar.
I have only hit my head once. Last week, when I was doing a one-foot spin, I fell and hit my head on the ice. But it didn't hurt too bad.
My kid - 2 LZ. Freak fall. Another kid - blades went out from underneath during stroking. Freak fall.
You can put as much padding on your head as you like, you're still going to end up with concussions. The helmet/padding will prevent a skull fracture - but, the concussion happens when your brain sloshes against the inside of your skull ... it's a shock wave impact. The brain gets bruised. Which is why each successive concussion is generally worse, particularly when someone hasn't taken adequate time to heal; think of getting a bruise on a bruise ... the blood vessels are already compromised and the second impact is on an already weakened structure.
There are studies going on about how to reduce the factor of concussion ... neck supports, mouthguards etc, but so far, nothing is proven ...
The BEST prevention is learning how to fall. Martial arts is excellent; you learn how to tuck, roll, react fast, protect the head ... that's saved us from quite a few nasty head injuries.
Two reported concussions on the elite scene this season:
- China's Nan Song crashed with Adam Rippon in warm up before LP in CoC, suffered concussion with short term memory loss. He competed in TEB two weeks later, obviously still weak.
- Russia's Julia Lipnitskaia withdrew from GPF because she "split her chin open after losing her balance on a jump in training" and suffers a mild concussion.