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The Pro Shop / Re: Question on pain along inner side of foot
« Last post by DressmakingMomma on December 10, 2017, 11:25:51 AM »
And this is the right boot. Hard to capture in a picture, but the shadow where the first eyelet starts is the dent that has started forming.
The Pro Shop / Re: Question on pain along inner side of foot
« Last post by DressmakingMomma on December 10, 2017, 11:22:51 AM »
Okay, lets see if this works. I'm attempting to link to a picture of her insoles. These are just about a year old.
The Pro Shop / Re: Question on pain along inner side of foot
« Last post by DressmakingMomma on December 10, 2017, 11:04:27 AM »
Thanks Query, your questions are helpful in that they have me thinking more deeply about the 'why' of how her foot hurts. With that in mind, what do you think about the following ideas?

It is the whole inside of her foot, more on the right foot than the left, but both feet hurt. The dent developing in the boot is on the outside by the ankle. She pronates significantly. Now I'm thinking that if the outside or ankles of the boots are no longer giving her the support they used to, then she is feeling the pressure of her foot wanting to push inwards from her pronation and causing the pressure/pain along the inside of her foot.

She uses cork heel wedges to correct her pronation under her insoles, but I have noticed something else. The marks on her insoles show really dark marks by her heels and her big toes, but have faint marking at her ball and no marking at her arches. I am thinking that means her arch is not making contact with the insole and she needs greater arch support. I also wonder if that means much of her skating is on her big toe and not on the ball of her foot. I don't know ANYTHING about proper technique (I leave that to the coaches) but I am thinking that you would have more marking under the ball of your foot rather than your big toe. I wonder if the cork wedges under her heels are lurching her too far forward onto her toes and she is countering that by applying all sorts of pressure to that big toe rather than the balls of her feet.

I also noticed that the tongue feels soft and bendable - so it probably isn't giving as much support as it used to either. Her boots are custom Harlicks, and they rebuild support and replace tongues for a reasonable amount of money.

Thanks for your guidance. I'm going to see if I can upload a picture or two.
The Pro Shop / Re: CW crossovers and foot sliding
« Last post by Leif on December 10, 2017, 03:58:26 AM »
Unfortunately it's not possible to get better than 1/1000" around here except on rare occasions. Yes I too like sharp blades.

I had them redone, and my right foot no longer slides when doing forward CW crossovers. I still need to work on technique though as they are nowhere as good as my ACW crossovers. The sharpener did suggest a deeper hollow. I am just over 11 stone, or 70Kg, and the local rink has hard ice, so maybe 1/2" is more appropriate.

I will for sure buy a machine, either a ProSharp or a Sparx. The latest sharpen was on a ProSharp machine, and it feels very good.
The Pro Shop / Re: Question on pain along inner side of foot
« Last post by Query on December 10, 2017, 01:29:48 AM »
Fixing the bend in the boot itself would be hard. For example, if the boot is breaking down, and isn't too old, some boot makers will "rebuild" the skate - for a fee, possibly $50 - $100 (USD). You have to call the boot maker to check. And it isn't necessarily the problem. Plus, you may loose access to the boot for a few weeks.

There are six very quick, cheap and dirty temporary things you could try:

1. Add a little tape or adhesive foam on the side of the boot directly opposite the bend. My assumption is that the bend is pushing your foot over onto the the opposite side of the bottom of her feet more than before. The new tape will create a counter-pressure.

2. Examine the insole, and what is underneath. Is a nail or other bump coming through, that is hurting the foot?

3. Stick on a little tape or adhesive foam (e.g., molefoam) underneath the insole directly underneath the point that hurts. (My assumption is that the part of the foot that hurts isn't getting enough support.)

4. Stick a little tape or adhesive foam everywhere underneath the arch on the inside of the foot. (My assumption is that the entire arch isn't getting enough support.)

5. Remove the tape or foam from the place that hurts. (My assumption is that the part of the foot that hurts is getting too much support, relative to the rest of the arch.)

6. Stick a little tape or foam EVERYWHERE on the insole except the point that hurts. (My assumption is that the part of the foot that hurts is getting too much support, relative to the entire rest of the foot.)

If none of these removes the pain, I don't want to speculate on what would help. But you can hopefully get back to where you were, and do not harm, by removing the tape or foam.

BTW, if your coach doesn't know what to do, but there is a very good skate tech in your area, he/she might be able to fix the problem. But I love just taking the empirical approach, and trying things myself.

Anyway, good luck.

Oh, one more thing: If it feels like there is a lot of pressure on the top of the foot, in the toebox, maybe it could be stretched, upwards.

Let's hope it isn't caused by a foot injury!
The Pro Shop / Re: CW crossovers and foot sliding
« Last post by Query on December 10, 2017, 01:01:03 AM »
Try measuring the height difference at several places along the blade. See if you get consistent results.

If, OTOH, you get one edge higher in the center, and the other edge higher at the ends, that would suggest you have a warped blade, and a sharpener who lacks the proper means to straighten it, at least while sharpening.

I've never heard before of anyone viewing .001" edge height difference as insignificant. For example, when a good skate tech wants to create a "skid" point on a blade (to make it easier to do skidded jumps, or, for hockey goalies, to make it easier to slide on the back of the blade from side to side, they might lower the appropriate part of the outside edge or edges by about .001". It's enough to make an enormous difference - so say two very good skate techs, who specialize, respectively, in figure and hockey blades. Some people want an even smaller change - e.g., Mike Cunningham told me that one of the world class figure skaters he sharpens for wants the front outside edge on the jumping foot lowered by just .0005" - and apparently, she felt she could tell the difference, because they determined the amount by experiment. Of course that is slightly different - Mike sharpens the blade symmetrically, then dulls one edge a little bit more than usual, using a stone. That should create a less sharp lowered edge. (He always dulls edges a little, unless requested otherwise, to reduce the change a skater might otherwise notice between sharpened and unsharpened edges, and because extremely sharp edges are quite fragile. That said, I personally like sharp edges.)
I went from the MK Pro to the Matrix Legacy and the main reason was that I could go at least twice as long between sharpenings. I found it took around 5 hours to get used to the new profile.

Wow. It took me so much longer to transition from MK Dance to Matrix Dance.

Were you fairly young? I've noticed that many young people transition much more quickly than older adults, to many sorts of new equipment.

Or maybe I am just that much less athletic and adaptable than you.
The Pro Shop / Re: Coronation ace vs Gold star blades
« Last post by tstop4me on December 09, 2017, 05:44:38 PM »
Thanks for your input Doubletoe! I actually hadn't even considered the Pattern 99, but I will check it out.

Now I'm wondering whether I should just stick with the Coro Ace after all! Having skated on them for so long, I don't know whether I'll regret changing blade. Surely, after some adjustment period, one can get used to any blade!

It is such a hard decision  :-\ :-\
Your original post specifically addressed a comparison of Coronation Ace and Gold Star blades.  I have skated with Coronation Ace, but not with Gold Star, so I haven’t responded up to now.  But since you’re the OP and have opened the bounds of the discussion, I feel I can discuss my recent upgrade experience without being guilty of thread drift.

(1) Yes, it is a hard, and expensive, decision to upgrade from an intermediate blade to an advanced blade.  Intermediate blades are typically in the ~$200 range (with exceptions); whereas advanced blades are typically in the ~$500 – $600 range (with exceptions).  And with one exception, you can’t test drive a blade (the exception is Eclipse:  you can return a blade for a full refund within a 60-day trial period; I think that’s a great marketing strategy ... wish other manufacturers would follow suit).  Not many skaters (including coaches and skate techs) have direct personal experience with a variety of blades; so it’s hard to get advice.  And which blade is best depends strongly on the individual skater anyway; so what’s best for your coach, skate tech, or fellow skater may not be what’s best for you.

(2) With advanced blades, there are a large number of parameters to consider.   These include (not an exhaustive list):

(a) Main rocker radius
(b) Spin rocker radius
(c) Pick design and placement
(d) Heel length
(e) Longitudinal blade geometry (parallel, tapered, parabolic, and combo parabolic and tapered)
(f) Transverse  blade geometry (planar, concave side-honed, and dovetail side-honed)
(g) Blade thickness
(h) Stanchion height
(i) Runner (edge) material (various grades of carbon steel, various grades of stainless steel, and one unusual titanium alloy)
(j) Blade body and mounting plate material (various grades of carbon steel, various grades of stainless steel, aluminum alloy, titanium alloy, and carbon-fiber composite)
(k) Overall blade construction and method for attaching the runner to the blade body and mounting plates.

So you see, there’s a lot more than just the main rocker radius to be concerned about.  Which parameters are important to your skating is an open question.

I’m not as advanced a skater as you.  I don’t jump at all these days (most I ever did were half jumps);  I concentrate on edge work and trying hard to get a good scratch spin.  I skated many years on Coronation Ace, then switched to the Eclipse Aurora (also 7’ radius main rocker, but a flatter spin rocker).  I recently upgraded to the Paramount Freestyle 12”; similar to (but not identical to) the Wilson Gold Seal, with an 8’ radius main rocker and a 12” radius spin rocker.  My coach really loves Gold Seals, especially the spin rocker, and recommends that her students upgrade to them once they have enough edge control.  Until recently, I haven’t upgraded since I didn’t want to spring for the $$$, and I figured I didn’t need them since I don’t jump.  But she convinced me that I’d do better with the small radius spin rocker.  I chose Paramount instead because it offers a blade with a 12” radius spin rocker in 440C stainless steel.

I’ve just completed 10 sessions (1.5 hrs each) on the Paramounts.  With respect to edge work performed on the main rocker, there was surprisingly an instant noticeable difference between the 7’ radius and the 8’ radius. 

The first was the increased glide (increased speed and distance per push), on straight and curved trajectories and on cross-overs, both forwards and backwards.  Before, at times, I had trouble completing a full circle on a single push-off during figure 8’s.  No longer.  When practicing cross-overs along a full circle or along a figure 8 pattern across two end-zone circles, I have to deliberately slow down; else, I pick up too much speed.

The second was the increased stability.  I can do deeper knee bends and ankle bends, lean deeper into edges, and lean backwards more strongly.  It’s hard to describe, but I just feel more control ... I feel less likely to fall off an edge or off the heel.  I do regular practice drills with consecutive edges (outside and inside edges, forwards and backwards), and they are all tighter and smoother now. 

So, with respect to edge work on the main rocker, I’m really happy with the 8’ radius instead of the 7’ radius.  I wouldn’t switch back, and now I wish I had switched earlier.  Again, I’m (pleasantly) surprised at the results.  In summary, in considering options for an advanced blade, perhaps you shouldn’t limit yourself to a 7’ radius main rocker.  Caveat:  Not sure how the larger radius would affect a camel spin; perhaps someone else could address that.  At your level, I assume you're working with a coach?  You should ask your coach for compelling reasons why you should upgrade (or not).

Mirage is an 8' main rocker, spin rocker = not much.  My skater went from that blade to the 7' main rocker Mist with no negatives so far, other than the BIG drag pick which has been caught a few times.  Her fitter likes the Ultima blades because of less variation in mfg., she has to reject fewer blades than those from Wilson and MK.  We probably would have gone with the Legacy if not for the bargain we got on the Mist.
The Pro Shop / Re: Coronation ace vs Gold star blades
« Last post by Live2Sk8 on December 09, 2017, 11:11:36 AM »
I'm going through the same thought process as lyssykw but with MK Professionals as the current blade instead of Coronation Aces.  I have heard that the Coronation Ace and MK Professional are very similar - so Doubletoe, would Pattern 99 be your same suggestion for someone upgrading from MK Professional - to go to Pattern 99 instead of Gold Star?  What about MK Vision? 

Lyssykw, I will be interested to hear what you ultimately decide. 
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