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The Pro Shop / Re: Jackson Debut Boot
« Last post by davincisop on Today at 03:04:14 PM »
RE: The font they used. My friend is friends with Mark Ladwig, I wonder if I could somehow get a memo to the higher ups and maybe see if they'd let me do some custom calligraphy for the boot so it doesn't have that ugly stock font and horrible spacing.
The Pro Shop / Re: Jackson Debut Boot
« Last post by Sibelius on Today at 02:39:35 PM »
I sent off an inquiry to Jackson about whether it's really closer to the Freestyle in stiffness.  That's where we should be next.  She hasn't broken her Elle's down yet, but they won't fit much longer.  She's little so the lighter weight would benefit.  Also don't really want to buy the Freestyle kit since she's moved on to an intermediate freestyle blade.

I suspect we'll have to order a Debut, a Freestyle (original) and Freestyle Fusion to see what fits best.  Unfortunately we'll have to pay restocking and shipping on all of them that don't work.  I really hope I can avoid that cost, might as well go with SP Teri or Harlick at that point.  We'll see what we can do when her fitter gets back.
The Pro Shop / Re: Jackson Debut Boot
« Last post by tothepointe on Today at 02:06:37 PM »
I would have liked the lighter stiffness. I can't really comment on how well the microfiber wears since I've only had them since August (regular sole) but they seem to be fairly cut resistant. The initial break-in was fast in terms of comfort but I would have liked if the tongue had softened up more.

I'm guessing this sole is what my fitter was talking about when he said they were coming out with an injection moulded sole.

I do think this will be successful for them at least in the short term. Because it mimics some of the aesthetic qualities of the Ice Fly but at a stiffness and price that is more appropriate for some of the lower level skaters that want them. Mainly talking about the young girls that are attracted to the rhinestones and silver heel.

I'm fairly happy with the fit and my skating has improved light years since I switched. I went from not being able to pass Pre-Alpha for about 18 months to be able to hold hip level spirals for the length of the rink as well as working on mohawks and 3 turns and stuff within 4 months. But that's because it fits rather than any magical boot quality. I feel much more of a connection to my blade.

The Pro Shop / Re: Jackson Debut Boot
« Last post by Sibelius on Today at 01:04:08 PM »
I've yet to see them in the wild.  My daughter has the leather Elle, and it's pretty cut up as it is after 7 months.  Depending on what her coaches and her fitter say we might give it a go. I'm all in for the lighter weight if it's significant.  Maybe I can convince the fitter to order a sample boot in her size!  Except for that gray sole...
The Pro Shop / Re: Jackson Debut Boot
« Last post by AgnesNitt on Today at 12:47:39 PM »
And aren't they microfiber?

How does that last with hard wear?
The Pro Shop / Re: Jackson Debut Boot
« Last post by Sibelius on Today at 12:26:09 PM »
I posted on this a couple of days ago.  I'm not sure what they're doing.  2 different Debut stiffnesses, (the original Debut was deemed way too stiff for my skater).  The Debut std. firm is the same number as the Freestyle now.  They seem all over the map.  Not sure about the aesthetics of the Fusion sole, and that of the Freestyle/Elle Fusion boots.  My skater says they look clunky, whereas the Debut, except for that font issue someone mentioned, look nice.

We'll probably just go with the original Freestyle and swap out the blade.
The Pro Shop / Re: Jackson Debut Boot
« Last post by tstop4me on Today at 07:23:15 AM »
Looks like they designed the Freestyle as well.

This is bizarre.  The Debuts are listed as "Competitive" models, sold as a boot only.  There's a new model Freestyle Fusion and a new model Elle Fusion.  Both are listed as "Recreational" models (a lower grade than Competitive), sold as a kit with pre-mounted blades.  Yet the Freestyle Fusion and Elle Fusion are both listed as being built on the Elite last (used on the top of the line Jacksons), not on the new Debut last that you discussed in a previous post for intermediate level boots.  Mr. Spock would say, "That's not logical."
The Pro Shop / Re: Jackson Debut Boot
« Last post by tothepointe on Today at 01:41:38 AM »
Looks like they designed the Freestyle as well.
The Pro Shop / Re: Jackson Debut Boot
« Last post by tothepointe on Today at 01:39:39 AM »

Well, I guess they released their new sole. Mimicking the look of the Avanta
The Pro Shop / Re: Sharpening near the toe pick
« Last post by Query on November 23, 2017, 11:25:41 AM »
I actually prefer a coarser stone than either of the Pro-Filer stones to make the initial cut on the previously unsharpened part - like is on the old Berghman sharpeners - because it is fast enough to create a full depth hollow in a more reasonable amount of time. The way I see it, if the hollow isn't ground deep enough to touch the sides of the blade, it doesn't actually create a sharper edge angle.

Unfortunately, the Berghman sharpeners were only made for 1/2" hollows, so the front part wouldn't be the same hollow, unless you finish it with your Pro-Filer. The oldest are available on eBay for as little as $5, though a more modern one, made in the 1950's, would have a less crumbly stone. The Berghmans too can be used right up to the toe pick - in fact I find it easier to control. However, because they are coarse, they can't create quite as sharp an edge, if you are into super-sharp edges. I prefer the Berghman handle to the Pro-Filer handle, but you can place the stone your Pro-Filer handle - use a hammer and a "pin punch" to remove the pin keeping the old stone in that handle; maybe you could use an appropriate size cheap disposable hex key instead. (I'm not sure if a rivet remover could also be used.) You can hammer the pin back in when the new stone is in place. (The Berghman tools use a wing-nut driven pressure fit instead, and stone replacement is much faster. As with the Pro-Filer, rotate the stones periodically to get uniform wear, and since the stones are crumbly, to get a more uniform radius hollow.)

You can also buy online appropriate diameter (2*ROH) cylindrical sharpening stones (search for "cylindrical stones", and if you can carefully use cardboard, "abrasive sleeves" and "spiral bands") from several sources, with various grits. I think a 60 - 80 grit stone will cut fairly fast. I think you can even use the cylindrical stones from a hockey tool, like (though that page doesn't seem to work anymore).

As far as how close you should come to the toe pick: Try this experiment: Color the bottom of the blades with pencil. Skate. Do some 3-turns and jumps. I think you will find that the ice wears off the pencil all the way up to the back pick - and also takes off the hollow on most of the blade, which implies that even more of the blade (briefly?) touches than you think. I don't know how much that depends on technique or how hard you jump and land, as I have only tried it for me. I don't point my toes enough to use the other picks, but I'm told a better, more flexible skater would.

When I sharpen the area close to the toepick with Pro-Filer or similar hand tools, I put cloth tape (I use cloth first aid tape, but duct tape should work) on the pick itself, so I don't accidentally touch and dull it. I think that is a good idea.

You can also VERY carefully enhance the edge on the toe pick itself - but only if you ARE very careful not to dull the corners. I'd never try that with a standard machine sharpener. Whether or not you need that depends on how much sideways grab you want the picks to have. Clearly the majority of the figure skating population makes due with the factory grind on the toe picks, and the Jackson Ultima blades start out VERY sharp, including in the toe picks. For that matter, most figure skaters get by without sharpening the area close to the toe pick at all, and most don't believe it is needed. So unless and until you have to trim the back pick to match the wear on the rest of the blade, you might decide to leave the toe pick itself alone.

I guess you theoretically could sharpen very close to the toe pick using the cross-grinder on a standard powered sharpening machine, if it has one. You might want to turn the skate around mid-sharpening, to get the edge symmetric, because cross-grinders don't otherwise do that very well. I haven't enough experience to trust my blades at all to those powered sharpening machines. I feel they take off more metal, and it is too easy for me to make mistakes on them. So I haven't tried sharpening close to a toe pick on them.
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